Transcript

Event transcript
OK. 00:00:02
Oh no. 00:00:05
Yep, city. 00:00:09
OK, it's time. 00:00:14
All right. 00:00:16
Person in public. 00:00:19
Remind me if I mess it up. 00:00:23
All right. 00:00:25
All right. Good evening. Welcome to the 27 May 2025 historic preservation. 00:00:33
Council meeting. 00:00:38
We just want to make sure our mice are turned on, so everybody just make sure your mics are turned on. 00:00:40
Yep. And then we'll do a roll call and we'll start left to right. 00:00:45
Kelly Knapp. 00:00:49
Melvin Taylor, Julie McCullough, Scott Duo Voice. 00:00:51
All right, it looks like we have a quorum for tonight. 00:00:56
And the first thing that we need to do is. 00:01:00
I just want to make sure they there were no comments from the city or if there were, then we can we can go ahead and. 00:01:05
Work through this. 00:01:10
Not at this moment. We just make sure we need to approve the minutes from now. 00:01:12
Yes, absolutely so. 00:01:15
Of the city, we need to approve the minutes from from the last meeting from March 20. 00:01:18
I'm sorry. 25 March 2025. 00:01:23
So we received that e-mail in our packets. 00:01:26
So can I have a motion please? 00:01:28
I'll make the motion to approve the minutes. 00:01:33
I second. 00:01:36
OK, well, did you? 00:01:37
Have any questions on them? No no no no, I was lost in thoughts. OK awesome. Yep I am too, always. 00:01:40
OK, all in favor say aye. 00:01:45
All right. So that's unanimous. 00:01:48
All right, so old business. So we have the purple door. 00:01:52
So, 100 Osborne St. 00:01:56
Unit B and they're requesting new outdoor signage. 00:01:58
And the property is designated historic. So the first thing we're going to do is. 00:02:02
Just hear from the city 1st. 00:02:05
And then we're going to hear from you, ma'am. 00:02:07
Yeah. 00:02:10
Really only thing from the city is that we would like to see some more detail which what the sign is going to look like. 00:02:12
And I don't think you're going to be able to have. 00:02:19
Two of those large signs out front, I think you're just going to have to have how many entrances or? 00:02:22
Into your building. How many do you have? Actually, before we do that, can you come up and state your name and your address? 00:02:28
No, it's not that bad. Like, seriously. 00:02:33
Is definitely not that bad. 00:02:36
Tracy O'Brien. 00:02:40
Three years, yes. 00:02:42
Oh, is your mic on? 00:02:44
The reason is we typically have a couple of 1000 people on video. I'm joking around about that. I'm sure it's not a couple 1000. 00:02:51
Right. So the sign I have up there now is like a just a plastic sign. 00:02:57
I want to do an aluminum sign. There's one on the. I don't know what side that would be. 00:03:05
What is that facing? 00:03:09
I have one on both sides. 00:03:11
Yes. 00:03:14
So the one. 00:03:16
Facing Osborne would probably be the one that I would keep because that one gets a lot more attention. 00:03:18
Agree with that. Yeah. And it's just going to be aluminum. 00:03:24
An aluminum sign 3 foot by three foot. And then I was thinking because I have another store up north in Lowell IN which I'm sure 00:03:27
you know of. Oh yeah, in my store there has it's framed in with like a wood purple. 00:03:34
I don't know. 00:03:42
It's basically if you see, if you look at it. 00:03:43
Sorry if you go back up. 00:03:46
Yeah, kind of like that where it would have like a purple frame around it and it would be an actual aluminum sign. Right now it's 00:03:49
just like a. 00:03:53
Vinyl sign The only thing that I worry about up there is the wind is really strong. 00:03:57
I mean, I'm sure if it's enforced and it's up there it'll be fine, but. 00:04:06
That's kind of this would be facing. 00:04:09
The water, it would be the other side that I guess if I can't do 2 then I would do the one that's facing seagulls. 00:04:12
So I think like from here, I think. 00:04:19
What I would like to do is like here from the city. 00:04:21
Hear from anybody from the audience and then we will discuss it. 00:04:23
And like the goal is like. 00:04:27
To get it to yes and like just let you know exactly. 00:04:29
What we need to do the meant to make that 100% right 'cause. 00:04:33
We're not about wasting anybody's time. We want to make sure that we get this taken care of. 00:04:36
So I will go back, we'll go to the city 1st and she's up here so. 00:04:40
Like we're just talking about the placement of 1 sign and you can also put a sign above your door, your main entry. 00:04:45
Door 6 inches by 18 inches OK If you if you choose to do 6 inches by 18 inches, OK. 00:04:52
Yeah, I would probably do that. That'd be fine. 00:05:00
Like I was telling him my lease is up in October there I'm already because Camden County is so big because I do prom and bridal. 00:05:03
Oh yeah. 00:05:07
Camden County so big I'm almost like grown out of that spot already. 00:05:11
OK, I'm most likely going to try to get another location so. 00:05:14
I don't want to do too much. 00:05:19
I understand, you know, to their building. Yeah. Actually like, is he like keeping that location and then and then going getting a 00:05:21
second location or kind of moving away from that one, something bigger? OK. So getting leaving that location and going into 00:05:26
something different. I'd like to stay in Saint Mary's because I do like St. Mary's, Yeah. 00:05:31
It's just identifying a bigger spot, and that's kind of an odd spot being up there. People find me because they're looking for me. 00:05:38
But I don't want to do, you know, they find because that's what they're looking for. 00:05:44
But I'm OK with just doing the one sign and then one over the door. That's fine. Is the sign OK though? 00:05:49
It is, do you think? 00:05:54
Order reform. It talks about being acrylic right? 00:05:57
Acrylic acrylic are going to be. 00:06:01
I could do either one. 00:06:05
So we're going to wrap this up in a bowl too as well. 00:06:07
You know, to make sure, like before you leave here, it's like, OK, this is kind of what it looks like. We try to do that. So it's 00:06:11
not like you're leaving here and you're like, well, I don't even know what to do. 00:06:16
You know, I mean, so we'll make sure this is this gets good. 00:06:21
Just tell me exactly what you want me to do. Yeah. Yeah, Absolutely. Yeah. No, no, 100%. 00:06:24
Huh. Am I done now? Well, actually, no. 00:06:29
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:06:32
Just a little bit longer. 00:06:33
Reason why the city kind of get through there is that we'll. 00:06:39
And then we'll ask a couple of questions 1.8. 00:06:44
And aluminum single sided. 00:06:47
So from us, I think we're probably OK with it unless you guys needed to see something. 00:06:55
I think that. 00:07:00
I think when we spoke. 00:07:02
Is this one OK? When we spoke last month or maybe even the month before, one of the things that we were hoping to see was a little 00:07:03
cohesiveness between market on the square sign and your sign. There are signs really bold and in the right. 00:07:11
Look and then yours is not, not anywhere. 00:07:19
Close to what they've got. I'm not asking you to mimic theirs exactly. The other thing, and I'm I'm a school teacher, so it's a 00:07:23
pet peeve of mine. There's no apostrophe in Saint Mary's. It's just Marys. And so that's really important if we're going to. 00:07:29
God's laughing at me because he sees it from me all the time, you know, and to me you've. That's a great store. And I love the 00:07:37
purple door idea, it just seems like. 00:07:42
Your your the lettering is really, really small and you know, you worry so much about people being able to find you. That would 00:07:47
probably just be something was the D. 00:07:52
Divine store that's across the way that you know, we had that conversation with them because they've got Louisa bookstore and 00:07:58
their store and so they kind of made the the. 00:08:04
The signs where they were a little more cohesive and matched one another. So I don't know if that's something that you could look 00:08:10
to do. Obviously, you don't want to spend a lot of money if you're moving. 00:08:15
Right, Yeah, definitely something. But I mean I'm not opposed to the aluminum at all. To me the size is sort of big hanging where 00:08:20
it's hanging. I think if there were some other places that it was it was put, it might be better. But regardless, just the 00:08:26
apostrophe in Saint Mary's and. 00:08:32
Maybe just a little more cohesive with market on this square and I want to also bring the conversation back a little bit too. Just 00:08:38
play devil's advocate is like. 00:08:42
You know, is this something that we're willing to like, approve, like? 00:08:46
If she like, if you're like 80% sure you're gonna move or 90% sure you're gonna move. 00:08:50
Just so you're not investing a ton into it. 00:08:54
That we may be able to approve something potentially till that time. 00:08:57
Frame where was she moves to should be able to take. OK, that's very true. 00:09:00
OK. 00:09:06
Right. OK, OK. Yeah. 00:09:07
Yeah, I would like to add to what Julia said, which. 00:09:10
Agree, but. 00:09:14
I think the. 00:09:17
The issue I have is not only does it contrast, I love the purple door. I mean that is just just great. 00:09:19
But it is again. 00:09:27
With the market on the square and that old timey, the more of the historic look. 00:09:30
That sign? 00:09:35
Being up there really bright and bold, but more than that hanging over the rails and I think, you know, just going back and 00:09:37
looking at the codes. 00:09:41
There is. There are specifics about. You don't cover up any detail. 00:09:46
Of the of the structured. 00:09:51
Let me find where this is. It says the. 00:09:55
The proposed material change in appearance would not have a substantial adverse effect on the aesthetic, historical, or 00:10:00
architectural significance and value. 00:10:05
In the historic district and also signs must not distract or detract from the visual historic character. 00:10:10
Of the Saint Mary's Historic District and shall not obscure architectural details of the building and property. 00:10:18
So I'm thinking that. 00:10:25
Is an example of what? 00:10:29
They're talking about but. 00:10:32
I mean, can it go above? Can it be? 00:10:35
Yeah. Could it be hung above those steps and maybe I know you're worried about the wind. 00:10:39
But from the top and then from the bottom, so you wouldn't have that worry. 00:10:45
Yeah, I could move it down to like where it would be. 00:10:51
Attached, I guess, to the bottom there and then to the building. Yeah, or even above, above the steel rail. 00:10:55
Oh, like way up on the. 00:11:04
OK, gotcha. Yeah. 00:11:06
It's just, I mean, they're almost. 00:11:08
Fighting with each other. 00:11:10
Because they are different looks. It's hard because if I put it down, then people are going inside. Yeah, I know. Yeah. 00:11:12
And if we put it too high, people, then it's hard to see. I know it's really awkward. So when saying this, I'm just yeah, it's 00:11:22
it's really awkward. 00:11:26
This is a good discussion and I like obviously we're not, you know, we're. 00:11:30
You know, we all come together and I think that. 00:11:34
There's a lot of good ideas here, so. 00:11:37
I guess my question to the board would be like in the city as well is like. 00:11:39
Can we get to a yesterday? 00:11:42
And if so, then what does she need to do to get to that? Yes. 00:11:44
I've already said what I think that. 00:11:50
Needs to be done from the city's perspective, yeah. 00:11:52
It needs to come down to. 00:11:56
One large sign and one sign above the door. 00:11:57
OK, so one large sign, one sign above the door. 00:12:00
OK, I agree with Julia with the font. Maybe if you change the font to look a little bit more historic. 00:12:03
But the location? 00:12:11
I think that's. 00:12:13
The best place for. 00:12:15
As far as safety with the wind as well. 00:12:17
And people going into market on the square or being too high, you won't, you won't see it. And we really need your business to 00:12:20
succeed. 00:12:24
Yeah, it is. I just. Yeah, I just. 00:12:28
Goes against what? Yeah, what the guidelines are. But at the same time, I know it's, you know, it's. 00:12:31
You got to bring in. 00:12:37
When you don't have another option but it does get windy there and if it's swinging in the breeze it could like I would want it to 00:12:39
be. 00:12:42
Adhered to quickly the contract. I mean, I think the contractor, whoever installed would know best how to do that if we did. 00:12:46
Move it down to that level. 00:12:54
Well, I can work on the font and putting my apostrophe in which I didn't even. I just made it so quickly alarm. 00:12:55
Again. Plus I would date where they they can read it a little bit better probably too from a distance. 00:13:03
OK, so do we. So I guess we're now we're getting more granular here. 00:13:08
Do we so is there expectation that? 00:13:14
You know, obviously one sign and then one sign above the door. 00:13:17
So we were there. 00:13:19
And then? 00:13:21
Location wise, can we spend a little bit more time on that, another minute or two? Yeah, on location, I just don't like the look. 00:13:22
So let's nail that down and then we'll and then we'll actually talk about the font. 00:13:29
And then we'll go. We'll kind of give. 00:13:33
You know, wrap that up in about. 00:13:36
So location. 00:13:39
So it sounds like we have a little bit of a. 00:13:41
I know. 00:13:43
That's why I'm kind of thinking, yeah. 00:13:46
Yeah. 00:13:49
Like right on Osborne St. if anything came open and that would be my main goal, yeah. 00:13:51
Yeah, the location covering up the bells. 00:13:56
But again, that is the best place as far as. 00:14:00
Not worrying about the. 00:14:04
And safety for and and the safety with that. 00:14:06
But also. 00:14:09
The look of marking on the square which? 00:14:11
The background. 00:14:14
Kind of melts in with the color of the building with that yellowish cream. 00:14:16
And then you've got that with the historic look, and then there's yours, and it's almost like a spotlight. 00:14:22
And there's such a contrast. 00:14:29
In the two. 00:14:31
That it looks like it was just and it's a beautiful. I mean, I love what you did with that. I mean, I like the purple. I like the 00:14:34
purple door. 00:14:37
Brighton and prom. I mean, it's just really. 00:14:41
Really hard. 00:14:44
Doing it the same color as their building. 00:14:46
Yeah, they're building. 00:14:50
Yeah. It's the location that I think that's it. 00:14:51
So with their respects, so can we. 00:14:55
Again, we don't obviously have to vote together on this page. 00:14:58
You could do. 00:15:01
For it or like a softer light or something that can make all the difference, yeah. 00:15:03
Yeah. 00:15:08
Maybe make it a? 00:15:09
Not so white. 00:15:11
Yeah. So let's go back to location really fast before we go to find. So like. 00:15:14
Location wise, can we? 00:15:19
Give her some direction on that. 00:15:22
I think the location is the best place where she has. 00:15:25
As far as visual and safety. 00:15:30
We are coming up on hurricane season if it's blowing in the wind. 00:15:34
It gets so windy down there. 00:15:38
I just. 00:15:41
Yeah. OK. So we so OK, so location is there. 00:15:43
And then the font. 00:15:46
So we kind of talked about that a little bit. 00:15:48
Maybe a darker tone? 00:15:50
Darker color. 00:15:52
Is that what we're kind of looking at right now? 00:15:53
OK. And does anybody know what that is? 00:15:56
No, but we can find out definitely. 00:16:01
Yeah, just search through, right? Yeah. Oh yeah. 00:16:05
So can you all let her know where that is? 00:16:09
And then and then we can kind of give probably at this point we probably need a little reworking of the sign and everything before 00:16:11
we approve it. I mean, I hate to delay you again on this, but. 00:16:16
Yeah, just. 00:16:22
We're almost there. So I think, yeah, we're almost there. So we like, we have to like. 00:16:27
We're like here. 00:16:31
We table it. 00:16:33
Why should we be able to? 00:16:35
Work on these changes that we're asking for. 00:16:37
Yeah, no, absolutely. 00:16:39
OK, so that's what and then? 00:16:41
I just wanted to see if there's any. 00:16:43
Anybody from the audience that would love to come up in comment about this? 00:16:45
Sorry. OK, that was kind of weird. The wording was bad. 00:16:49
Would anybody like to come up and say anything about the sign? 00:16:54
OK. All right. 00:16:58
So do you have any, Do you have enough guys? Do you have any questions for us? 00:17:00
We want to make this as simple as possible. We don't want to be like. 00:17:03
Where it doesn't blend also but it doesn't pop as much. 00:17:08
As long as you guys are fine with that because I can't really. I like, yeah. 00:17:17
Because the wind every day, even when it's not hurricane season, especially on the 2nd floor, is. 00:17:21
Yeah, can only imagine. 00:17:28
So no, I think I'm good and I'm OK with doing that. And then. 00:17:30
OK. 00:17:34
Awesome. Does anybody else have any comments up here? 00:17:35
All right. We really appreciate you. Yeah. Thank you. Oh, should we make a motion table? 00:17:38
Do you need to put a motion? 00:17:45
Table the item OK to next session. 00:17:47
Kenton. 00:17:51
We'll continue the discussion. Yeah, make a motion there, right? 00:17:52
I'll make a motion to continue the item to next month. 00:17:56
I'll second all in favor say aye. 00:18:00
Aye. 00:18:03
All righty. Thank you so much. 00:18:04
Thank you. All right, so new business, so we have. 00:18:06
A certificate of appropriateness for cracking coffee. 00:18:11
So request for Merle. 00:18:15
Of marine life to be painted on their building. 00:18:16
122 Osborne St. 00:18:19
And the properties in the historic district. 00:18:21
Do we have representative? 00:18:24
Hello, Sir. Hello. I'm Colby Claflin with Tracking Coffee and Kitchen Company at 122 Osborne, Suite B. 00:18:30
OK, awesome Sir. And we'll start with the city 1st. 00:18:38
I just wanted to see if the city had any questions. 00:18:41
Concerns. 00:18:44
We don't know. We've we've, we've looked at this. 00:18:45
Quite extensively with with staff and. 00:18:49
We like everything. It's a good idea. It's a good visual aspect for downtown. 00:18:52
OK. Any questions from the board? 00:18:56
Do you want me to start Kelly Hudson? 00:19:02
I have a couple of concerns. 00:19:07
I love Amanda. I assume this is Amanda Moore's work, Yes. 00:19:09
We have Amanda and we also have another gentleman from the local area here. 00:19:13
That is looking at painting. Definitely a big fan of her work. OK. 00:19:18
Two things, you know, we just met a second ago with the purple door and she says she may be moving from 1:00. 00:19:24
Facility to another but wants to stay in the downtown or in the Saint Mary's area. We come across this that if Kraken ever. 00:19:31
Outgrows the space and or moves. 00:19:39
We've got a large. 00:19:42
Kraken on the side of our building. 00:19:44
The second concern that I have is that this is in direct conflict with the ordinance. 00:19:47
Ordinance says exterior paintings that have to do directly with. 00:19:52
The properties business are are not appropriate for the area. That being said, somebody said well I know, but it's just a big 00:19:58
octopus. But y'all are the cracking coffee company and so if it were up to me, unfortunately I would probably tell you no on this, 00:20:04
but. 00:20:09
Yeah, and I have to concur with her simply again going back. 00:20:15
To the ordinance and. 00:20:21
You know, we like with the purple door, I mean there are some situations like with the location that. 00:20:24
That's there's the only that's the only place and I loved this. I think it's. 00:20:32
Just great. 00:20:38
But we do have to. 00:20:40
Do as much as we can to follow the guidelines. 00:20:43
And if we do that? 00:20:47
Then I mean, we're pretty much saying. 00:20:50
Whoever wants. 00:20:54
To put whatever. 00:20:55
This is beautiful, this is wonderful, but we don't know in the future. 00:20:57
Something might come up that conflicts with the. 00:21:02
The ordinance, the codes. 00:21:05
And we've already given a go ahead to something that didn't so. 00:21:08
It's hard, it's really difficult because so we to add to that. So we actually reached out to the owners of the building. 00:21:12
They agreed that it would be great. They signed the paper on that today. 00:21:21
We're on a five year lease. 00:21:26
And with the extension of five years? 00:21:28
To go along with that. And then we are taking donations to buy the building if you guys are willing and then we'll be there 00:21:30
forever. 00:21:34
So but anyways to go with that? 00:21:39
They have agreed and we just think it would be. 00:21:43
We'd have a little bit of a modification so it wouldn't look so bold on the top. 00:21:46
But with Amanda painting or the other gentleman on our local area here. 00:21:50
But it would just so there's a big following. I don't know if you guys. 00:21:56
Are aware of the big following of the butterfly wings. 00:22:00
There is 200,000 people that follow butterflies all around the world. 00:22:03
And that's where they make their travel destinations is to go to. 00:22:09
These things here and take pictures of them and post them on Facebook. This is how they make their destinations and. 00:22:13
We just thought it would be a great idea not only to do. 00:22:20
Help our business proceed forward. 00:22:24
But for the downtown Saint Mary's area to draw? 00:22:26
People down. 00:22:30
And get them excited to come down and visit downtown Saint Mary's. 00:22:31
We're all looking for that. 00:22:35
That what makes us come downtown to Saint Mary's. We've all been in that meeting. 00:22:36
We just figured that we would kind of throw this out there and we would kind of help. 00:22:41
Drive some people downtown. 00:22:46
With some great artwork from the locals. 00:22:47
Yeah, it is great artwork. 00:22:50
This guy is convincing. 00:22:53
Have you noticed? 00:22:54
Yeah, well, I mean what you're saying. 00:22:56
Is 100%. I'm a fan of your shop by the way. Thank you and. 00:22:58
The painting is beautiful, I like it, but I'm in agreement with Julia as far as. 00:23:07
Cracking coffee cracking on the. 00:23:13
On the wall, because that opens the door to we got a new pizza shop coming in. What if they want to paint a pizza on the side of 00:23:15
the building or the brewery? They wanna paint a big mug of beer on the side of the building. 00:23:22
So, you know, if we say yes to that, then we got to say yes to the others. Well, with the pizza shop, it it. 00:23:30
Already has Saint Mary's painted on the side of it. 00:23:38
Yeah, it already has a mural of Saint Mary's painted on this. Yeah, Yeah. So the pizza shop already has a mural on the side to go 00:23:40
with, you know what, if they wanted to paint a big pizza outside of the building? 00:23:46
You know, umm. 00:23:53
So what would you? What would you think of this idea? 00:23:54
So in the tentacle there. 00:23:58
We phase in. 00:24:01
The word Saint Mary's. 00:24:03
Yes, it is Marine. 00:24:08
So, so like on the like on the bottom, there were people would most likely take a picture right there by the around the window 00:24:10
there. 00:24:14
That we could actually phase into the tentacle itself. 00:24:18
That says Saint Mary's, Georgia. 00:24:21
What do you think? 00:24:26
This guy's a husband. 00:24:28
Like so just in all honesty, I didn't even know where Kraken was. 00:24:31
Like a Kraken was so the. 00:24:35
Something from that perspective. I mean, so where are we at here? So it sounds like we're at a. 00:24:38
At a stall here. 00:24:44
So are we. 00:24:46
Are we going to get to a yes here? Are we going to get to a number here? And if it's a no? 00:24:49
Then what needs to happen? 00:24:54
So I think that's kind of where we are right now. 00:24:56
Well, it's not our decision to decide what's going to happen, it's just we're voting on that. 00:24:58
Yeah, that's all. 00:25:02
That's all our job is. Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm saying like, so like. 00:25:04
How do we? 00:25:08
If it's like if we're all here and we're saying hey, like, this is not going to happen. 00:25:09
Then what does he need to do to change that? Does he need to just be something different or? Well, I think that. 00:25:14
Because the the issue is that. 00:25:20
In here it says that you cannot have a mural signed. 00:25:24
Picture that DEP. 00:25:28
Picks what the business is or. 00:25:30
What it's called in this case? 00:25:32
So I think that's the issue is there. 00:25:35
Something that. 00:25:39
Can be changed that. 00:25:41
It's not cracking. 00:25:43
So obviously the crack in. 00:25:46
Right, the cracking of the cracking coffee. So if I walk up to the screen. 00:25:48
So we take. 00:25:54
That top corner off where you're seeing the big part of the. 00:25:56
What you guys are calling the octopus or the tentacle right there, right? 00:26:00
We basically move the eye up to the corner of the square up there. 00:26:03
So it more looks like because honestly, nobody knows what a cracking looks like. 00:26:08
Yeah, that's why it's a crack and it's not an octopus. So we're we're putting it down as as. 00:26:13
That way it would look more like sea life. 00:26:18
Instead of a cracking. 00:26:21
If we took the big the octopus side of it. 00:26:23
Of the head off and moved it up a little bit and made the tentacles longer. 00:26:27
It would be, you know, that's that would be an option there. 00:26:32
Would that something like that work? 00:26:36
Well, uh. 00:26:38
I wonder, Julia, I don't know, I'm just talking here. 00:26:38
And Scott and Melvin, yeah, this is discussion. 00:26:43
But if you added. 00:26:47
More sea life. 00:26:50
Like subtle, I mean, would that or is it just the fact that? 00:26:51
It's, I mean it takes over the building, which is again. 00:26:55
Love it. It's just it's in the historic district and when you have these right. 00:27:00
But maybe. 00:27:06
Take it down, add sea life so it's more depicting. 00:27:09
Sea life, I mean, you brought that up about. 00:27:15
It doesn't look like a Kraken, it looks like sea life. 00:27:18
Would that suffice? I don't know. 00:27:21
I don't know. 00:27:24
Scott. 00:27:29
I don't know, I'm really struggling with it. I know this is because. 00:27:30
I mean like I always, I would say like my. 00:27:36
I guess my stance here would be to make it as simple as possible. 00:27:39
I mean, I think that if he like. 00:27:42
I mean, when you, when we talk about adding sea life, like, is that like adding like? 00:27:44
One or two fish. 00:27:49
Just something with us. 00:27:50
So when someone looks at it, they don't see a crack and if they know what a cracker looks like? 00:27:53
But they're seeing. 00:27:58
A mural of. 00:28:01
Umm to see since you want to have. 00:28:03
A little bit of what your business is called. 00:28:09
In there but. 00:28:13
Can't be. 00:28:15
Oh, that's the name of the business. So if I understand you correctly. 00:28:16
Are you saying that? 00:28:22
He can keep the same as Admiral like as he has right now, and then just add a couple of. 00:28:23
Sea life around it. 00:28:28
I mean. 00:28:31
That's so. 00:28:32
Because that's taking it over. But to bring it, I mean, I think our job in the historic district is for us to look at the code. 00:28:35
And the code clearly states Kelly already read it. 00:28:40
That pictures or paintings or artworks. 00:28:45
On buildings cannot depict. 00:28:50
The business that's inside. 00:28:53
That follows into that category. I mean, I think we. 00:28:55
I think it. 00:28:59
Yeah, see, I think it looks great. I mean, I think it's it's nice. I really do like it. 00:29:00
I think it adds to the building and all. 00:29:07
But my concern is. 00:29:09
That we set a precedent. 00:29:12
For others coming down the road. 00:29:14
So we really got to think about that. 00:29:17
And so with that said, I'm gonna have to vote no. 00:29:19
OK, so. 00:29:24
Public comment. 00:29:26
Yeah. So let's, let's let's go to public comment and then we'll come back to the board in the city. 00:29:27
And, umm. 00:29:31
And then we'll we'll wrap this up. 00:29:32
In a bowl like I always say. So do we have any comments from the from? 00:29:34
Anybody from the outside? 00:29:38
Oh, come on up. 00:29:40
Oh, can you? 00:29:42
He just come up because the reason is because you're on video. 00:29:44
So the everybody else I was. 00:29:47
And it was. 00:29:50
The address a difference Then could we put an octopus up there? 00:29:52
We need you to state your name and your address. I'm Kristen Claflin. I'm his wife and. 00:29:57
I'm also one of the owners. 00:30:02
For cracking. 00:30:05
But if we had a different name, could we put sea life pictures up there if our name was say? 00:30:06
I don't know. 00:30:13
If it was. 00:30:14
Or Saint Mary's coffee, Then could we put a Sea Life mural up there? 00:30:17
I think that ordinance simply says that if it. 00:30:22
If the artwork depicts. 00:30:25
The business inside, it's a no our starfish or. 00:30:28
A fish or. 00:30:34
A wave or something like that. 00:30:37
I think it would be. I mean. 00:30:39
From what I read, I think it would. 00:30:41
Because it's a Navy base. 00:30:43
But as Julia said, it's the name of the business and we're in the historic district. 00:30:46
With these, we could pick another sea creature. 00:30:51
That doesn't bother us. 00:30:57
What are you all thinking about that? 00:31:00
Do you have any suggestions of a sea creature? 00:31:02
Or maybe we could have Is it Amanda? 00:31:05
Oh, amenity. Yeah, because there's lots of manatees. 00:31:09
I mean, I think our job here is to either approve the certificate or deny it. 00:31:12
Yes. And then you can come back again with a just with a amended. 00:31:18
Certificate I think is what you probably need to Amanda. Is that her name? 00:31:23
She might even be able to drop something. I'm sure she she's very good. You guys just ahead of time, have any ideas of the sea 00:31:28
creature that you would like? I just have to come in front of us. 00:31:34
Yeah, so I would say this, I decided this last thing too is like. 00:31:40
The goal is to get to yes. 00:31:43
So I think they like, so obviously this is going to not get voted against, right? 00:31:45
But I think that if you, let's say versus, you did pick a like something that was not related to your. 00:31:50
Your organization, right? 00:31:56
It sounds like it's gonna be yes. So we're your champion. 00:31:58
But it just can't be that. OK, understandable reasons. 00:32:01
But yeah, like I think they and we'll give it ahead of time. 00:32:06
We usually get the readout like a little bit ahead. 00:32:09
A week or so ahead. 00:32:12
And, you know, and if there's some challenges there, then, you know, we can make sure that you get that information. 00:32:13
OK, so that way you're not wasting time coming back and getting it denied and coming back and getting it denied. We definitely 00:32:19
want to work with you. 00:32:22
Because we really have no. 00:32:26
I mean, it doesn't have to be. 00:32:28
A Kraken, but I think it would be neat to have something naval. 00:32:30
Being in this community, that part would be really cool. No 100%. 00:32:34
Well, at this time I'd like to. 00:32:40
Make a motion to deny the certificate of appropriateness for Kraken. 00:32:42
I second that. 00:32:46
All right, all in favor, say aye. 00:32:47
Aye, all right. 00:32:49
Thank you. No, thank you. 00:32:50
Are y'all sticking around for the? 00:32:52
The other thing on the agenda? 00:32:54
OK for the. 00:33:00
Outside seating. 00:33:01
Yeah, OK, awesome. Yeah. 00:33:03
That would be into the discussion. Yeah, in our discussion portion. 00:33:06
So the next thing we have. 00:33:10
Is distributed appropriateness for. 00:33:12
Mellon, Myrtle St. Request removal and if possible. 00:33:16
Replacing the palm trees on 213 E Weed St. 00:33:20
This property is designated in the Historic district. 00:33:24
Do we have? 00:33:26
The person. 00:33:28
Or people. 00:33:30
People, yes you can. 00:33:31
Yeah. 00:33:33
Hi, I'm Margie Shorekin from 213 E Wade St. 00:33:36
And I'm Mel Schoik at 213 E Queen St. 00:33:41
Hello. 00:33:44
All right. 00:33:47
So let me just say this that we moved here in 2016. 00:33:48
And we went. 00:33:53
To the board. 00:33:55
Probably 6 times. 00:33:56
And we complied with the city. 00:34:00
Got what we wanted, what they wanted. 00:34:03
It works. 00:34:07
OK. We appreciate definitely what the child. 00:34:08
OK. Thank you, Sir. 00:34:11
Did we describe or? Oh yeah, you can start. Yeah, absolutely. 00:34:14
I know you have. 00:34:21
One. So you want to remove this one. 00:34:25
Do you want us to read what I wrote? 00:34:31
I would just give us. 00:34:34
Some more information for the ones that you want. 00:34:36
To remove the size of them if there's if they're very small saplings like I've seen on most of your property. 00:34:39
I don't foresee that being a problem for you guys to move those. 00:34:45
Just maybe tell us how big these palm trees are, but I can't really read it. 00:34:49
OK. 00:34:54
So you have one close to Weed St. 00:34:57
So, well, one thing for sure is that we have some. 00:34:59
You call them saplings that we call them smaller ones. Yeah, they're in the Moat. 00:35:03
And we can't take those out because? 00:35:08
Well, you have a small pond like right here and right here. 00:35:11
Totaled of 24 palm trees. 00:35:15
If I've counted them all, there's 24. 00:35:17
So. 00:35:20
The two here over the Big X. 00:35:22
Those are the 2 that are. 00:35:28
If you measure 24 inches, yeah, I see 20 right here. Yeah. 00:35:31
And those are the ones. 00:35:35
And those are the reason why we. 00:35:38
Have looked at taking them out. 00:35:42
Is to help preserve the life of the big oak tree. 00:35:45
If it's already stressed from. 00:35:50
The salt water intrusion that comes in the property and it just sits there. 00:35:54
Because we're so close to the marsh and the. 00:36:00
And all that, this also takes the nutrients away from the roots, right? 00:36:03
Yeah, there's a good, that's a good photo. 00:36:08
So. 00:36:11
The one with the XS. 00:36:13
Over to the left. 00:36:15
Are these the exits inside the circles or outside the circles? 00:36:17
Let's say I'm sorry, they're just the X's. In or out means they go. 00:36:22
I thought this. 00:36:27
See this up there? This might look better. That right there is a Cities property by the way. 00:36:31
Yeah, see the line right here. 00:36:38
OK. 00:36:40
So the two. 00:36:41
The two circles with the X's inside. 00:36:43
Yes. 00:36:48
We've discussed this with the tree and yeah, and the tree board is. 00:36:50
Is on board with those being removed. 00:36:54
Actually, there are people that want it. 00:36:57
Good. Well, I think they're being. I think part of the approval from the tree board was that they'd be replanted somewhere, not 00:37:01
by. 00:37:05
If they're if they're on city property, they'll be replanted by the city. If they're yours, obviously you can. 00:37:10
That's but I just wanted to clarify. You can barely, I think right above the property owner's name. 00:37:15
Is where the division of. 00:37:22
City property and private property is somewhere right in there, right? Is that right? I think, yeah, I think you have a stake out 00:37:24
there as well. Or is that right? Yeah, Well, we cannot find, by the way. 00:37:30
We cannot find. 00:37:37
OK, I've talked to Jeff Fossum. He was supposed to. 00:37:43
Am I correct? 00:37:47
I haven't talked to him about this yet, but if he's planning on doing that then. 00:37:49
I'm sure you can see the one over here in our Moat. 00:37:53
You'll see it's very visible if you want to go by seeing. So I was going to say also like I think we can definitely start a 00:37:56
discussion up here. 00:37:59
On this because. 00:38:03
I think it's I've been past this this property. 00:38:05
So. So what do you all think? 00:38:09
Well, we have two separate matters here, right? 00:38:13
We have trees on city property. 00:38:16
And we have trees on private property and we are only here to handle the trees on the private property. The trees on the city 00:38:19
property will be handled by the tree board and that's already happened. 00:38:24
OK, perfect. That's already I'm in our meeting last month. 00:38:30
Yes, Sir. 00:38:35
The property on the city property. Cabinet palms on the city property. 00:38:36
Is going where? 00:38:42
Say that one more time. 00:38:44
He wants to know the cat, the cat's bombs. 00:38:46
On the city property. 00:38:49
That you want removed. 00:38:50
Removed because of because of the oak tree. 00:38:53
If those are going where? 00:38:55
That is, that is on behalf probably I'm going to. 00:38:57
I'm going to put Bobby Maher in charge of that, right. We'll have to figure out. We don't know yet. Yeah, we have some. 00:39:01
Right. But that's that I think the tree board said that if they are replanted on city property, then we would approve it. So it's 00:39:07
not a we're going to pull them out and give them to other people that they're going to be that they're going to be. 00:39:14
Moved to another location on city property. 00:39:20
That's between Taj and Bobby Mars. 00:39:25
So then the ones that we're looking at tonight on his private property, 123, Yeah. So, so anytime you all want to come by, right? 00:39:32
And I have been out here. 00:39:43
Jody, he has determined that these larger palm trees are interfering with the oak tree. 00:39:47
And its water consumption levels so that they need to go. 00:39:53
But again, that's a. That's a. 00:39:58
City property and the tree boards things, those aren't the cabbage ponds that we're talking about. The pumps that we're talking 00:40:00
about tonight don't have on his property with the oak tree. So let's just to clarify, is that right now? Oh yeah. 00:40:05
Yeah. 00:40:11
I know I don't think so. 00:40:12
So. So it sounds like just a bit less just to wrap this up. 00:40:15
So it sounds like the. 00:40:19
This portion of it. 00:40:21
It sounds like the city. The trees on the city property are good. They're going to be taken out. 00:40:22
They're already taken care of. 00:40:29
We need to the ones on the private property are the ones that we have to vote on right now. 00:40:31
So we can. So does anybody, Is anybody against the trees coming off the property? I have no problem. 00:40:35
Is there any stipulation of like them being replanted somewhere or so then they can. Those are the ones that you can give away to 00:40:43
anybody because they're on your property. It's your responsibility to to. 00:40:49
Have that taken care of too? That's not OK. OK, OK, so. 00:40:55
Do we have any discussion from outside? 00:41:00
Is there? OK? So what we'll do is. 00:41:03
We have one more person. 00:41:06
Coming up. 00:41:08
OK, umm. 00:41:09
So so. 00:41:10
So with that said. 00:41:13
It sounds like. 00:41:15
There's really no discussion on it, so it sounds like. 00:41:17
If we do vote yes, they you'll just have to have somebody just come out and remove those and then you can do whatever. 00:41:21
You want with him. 00:41:25
For the most part. 00:41:26
Down or replant them. 00:41:28
Yes, correct. Yes. 00:41:30
Stays on a We appreciate everything you've done. He's a pretty good guy. 00:41:32
Thank you so much. So let's do we have a motion for it? 00:41:38
I make a motion to approve the removal of the cabbage palms on Melon Murdie's property. 00:41:42
I make a motion to 2nd. 00:41:49
All in favor say aye. 00:41:51
Aye, all right. 00:41:53
Easy day. 00:41:55
Yes, that was really beautiful. 00:41:57
So the so the first discussion that we have. 00:42:01
Is umm. 00:42:05
Outdoor dining. 00:42:08
At 122 Osborne St. 00:42:10
For the cracking coffee. 00:42:14
I know this is something we've been having we've had in the works for a while. 00:42:16
And then we've been trying to, you know, kind of talking through. 00:42:19
So we're just going to dive right in. 00:42:22
From a city perspective, we think this is a great idea to use it right away. 00:42:27
And we definitely encourage this. 00:42:32
Yeah, and I've also had a couple of. 00:42:34
It sounds like the city council's on board. I've had a couple of City Councilman. 00:42:36
Reach out to me about it. I don't know if they've reached out to you all about it, but. 00:42:40
Yeah. 00:42:45
Yeah, I've had to. 00:42:46
They reached out to me about it. 00:42:49
So it sounds like there might be some some. 00:42:51
A little push there and. 00:42:55
A little support there for that. 00:42:57
So let's jump into the discussion. 00:42:59
I think everyone knows that I really love the idea. 00:43:02
Of the parklets, we've seen them used. 00:43:06
Throughout the country, internationally, I mean, they just. 00:43:09
There's such a draw. 00:43:13
Just bring. 00:43:16
Energy, I think it kind of keeps a pathway going when you have that. 00:43:17
I know that there are some safety issues, but I've read. 00:43:23
And I guess a lot of it depends on what you have, but if they have, you know, with the studies. 00:43:26
The amount of space, whether it's. 00:43:31
And even adding like bollards or plant. 00:43:33
Planners that are filled with water. I mean there are so many different ways to. 00:43:38
To increase the safety and. 00:43:43
So I personally. 00:43:46
Like the idea I. 00:43:49
I like it. And are we voting on? We're not voting on, just like we're asking. 00:43:51
Your blessing on this gotcha. OK, this we're moving to City Council. 00:43:55
And see what they have to say. Absolutely. 00:43:59
OK, so there's no bow here. It's just, hey, we agree with it. 00:44:02
Right. I mean, or could we vote on it or? 00:44:07
OK. So Nova, OK. 00:44:10
I mean, this is about the fourth time that this has been on our agenda and. 00:44:11
All four times we've had discussions of positive things and negative things, and I directly asked Jamie Stein, the head of. 00:44:16
Of the department. 00:44:24
Were we approving this or they just asking for a blessing as she said it was already a done deal and we can go back and look at 00:44:26
the tapes that she's asking for. 00:44:30
Our blessing on this. 00:44:35
I've received an e-mail from Jeremy Nassimanto, one of the City Council people, and I was very concerned about the idea that he 00:44:37
sort of. 00:44:41
And these are my words that he sort of brushed off that lawsuit with Milton that was a devastating event that happened. And we 00:44:47
have huge traffic problems down there. And, and as far as I'm concerned, the crack and coffee side of it isn't the problem is when 00:44:54
we open that other side up to a a brewery. 00:45:01
And they're not serving coffee. And there's going to be people, whether you like it or not. We've seen it in Saint Mary's. They're 00:45:09
going to take that beer and go, oh, there's a friend of mine and they're going to walk across that street to the other ones. 00:45:14
I love the idea. I wish that they would have looked at it for Stable Alley. 00:45:21
Instead of our main drag out there, I'm just, I think about a little over 5 weeks ago, Mark on the square got hit by a car. 00:45:25
Hit by a car and then Mr. Nassimanto said, well, you know, the speed limit is 25 and, and Milton happened in the area, that's 45. 00:45:34
We've seen speed limits. They don't know. People don't pay attention to speed limits down there. 00:45:41
The median is tight. 00:45:47
The parking is tight. I love the idea of this parklet. I think it's in the wrong place and it won't. It will not receive my 00:45:50
blessing same day. 00:45:54
Sure enough. 00:46:00
Anybody else? 00:46:03
Everything that Julie said, I agree with. I think it's a huge liability. 00:46:04
Market on the Square was just hit not too long ago. The tree down the street gets hit frequently. I just. 00:46:10
Think it's a big liability for the city? 00:46:17
Being being, you know it's going to be cracking spa. 00:46:20
But who's going to be responsible if somebody gets hurt? Is it going to be the city because it's a city right away? Or is it going 00:46:25
to be cracking? 00:46:29
I just those are those are some items that we're working out with this city attorney right now. 00:46:33
I just think it's a liability and I don't think us having a an insurance policy is. 00:46:38
Is that thing that makes it all OK? 00:46:44
Because we don't want to use that insurance policy when something devastating happens. Our downtown is for kid friendly. 00:46:46
It parents and. 00:46:53
Adults are going to be over it at Brackish Beer and the kids are going to be outside the parklets and they're going to be standing 00:46:56
right, right up against the area where. 00:47:01
They are allowed or aren't allowed and I just, I see something devastating, so I'm on the record. 00:47:06
Are there any safety features that are? 00:47:11
Being talked about and planned. 00:47:15
Aren't going anywhere. 00:47:18
Let's install those. 00:47:20
And Julian did send over a picture of a bollard, right? Yeah, they that's used. 00:47:21
Now those planners are not permanent. That was one of the huge, big selling points that when Jamie and. 00:47:28
Kansas presented this to us, that those would be movable. 00:47:34
Would be movable planters or concrete pieces, whatever they were. 00:47:38
So, I mean, I understand that the city, you know, the, the council's on board. I think it's, I think it could be catastrophic. 00:47:44
I actually need a different direction on it. 00:47:51
I think that. 00:47:54
I think the. 00:47:56
I think these things are well studied. I think they like really. 00:47:58
From my perspective, I don't really. 00:48:02
Look at this, I look at the safety portion of it, but. 00:48:05
I think if the city does their due diligence and they look at it and they go. 00:48:08
Hey, like if the impact is 40 miles, 45 miles an hour? 00:48:11
That you're still safe based on the. 00:48:15
You know, like the the protection or whatever. 00:48:17
Because like, I mean, I've been in these a lot and there's been traffic going 50-60 miles an hour. 00:48:20
On the side of me. 00:48:25
And I felt pretty safe with the setup. 00:48:26
And I like accidents do happen, but I just don't see. 00:48:31
If you set up the right way and I think if it's under the supervision of. 00:48:36
The city. 00:48:39
They you know, it could, it could it can work. 00:48:40
The one thing that I did want to bring up too was, and this is kind of way off the subject. 00:48:44
Is if it does get implemented. I saw there was like an extension of. 00:48:48
The painting. 00:48:54
Into that portion. 00:48:55
So is that something that we would have to? 00:48:57
Approved. Here they come back. 00:49:00
The rendition. 00:49:04
I think that can be talked about at that time too, yeah. 00:49:05
So this kind of my stance on it, I mean. 00:49:09
What do you think? 00:49:11
I because I'm. 00:49:13
I just got back from Puerto Rico actually, where they had a lot of those. 00:49:16
And they drive crazy though. 00:49:20
Yeah, but. 00:49:22
There didn't seem to be a problem at all, people just feel like why as it was. 00:49:24
As if it was just an extension of the store and stuff and it just added so much to the aesthetic that. 00:49:28
I'm for it and I just figure. 00:49:34
Sure, there's always. 00:49:37
The, you know, possibility that SO is going to be crazy. 00:49:39
Drive into it or whatever or but, but that's like with anything anyway. Yeah, that could be in a building too. 00:49:43
Yeah, it sounds so. It sounds like we have a house divided on it. 00:49:50
But. 00:49:54
Discussion, Yeah, it's only for discussion, right? So the house is divided on it, but. 00:49:55
So we have, we have you on record your opinion so that. Yeah. 00:49:59
Consideration with City Council. 00:50:04
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. But I think it's a great idea. Yeah. Can I add one more thing and this is? 00:50:05
You know, with the safety concern and I know they've got the planners. 00:50:11
Which is. 00:50:15
The norm. 00:50:16
Safety. 00:50:21
Feature whether it's a bollard but. 00:50:22
For that to be the external feature, to be the sight line when somebody is driving. So that comes you know, and I think there are 00:50:27
actually. 00:50:32
In different studies, different the amount of space that. 00:50:38
They have found that work. So I mean if they can take that into consideration. 00:50:42
Without any extra safety features. 00:50:47
OK. 00:50:49
So my last question would be another here right now in the audience like what's next steps? 00:50:52
At this point, we'll send you over for City Council. 00:50:57
OK, so like the next meeting? 00:51:00
He'll be the next meeting, but. 00:51:02
That is the plan. OK, gotcha. OK. So then once they and then just offer more clarification on our side if the City Council does 00:51:04
approve it. 00:51:08
Then they'll just come back to us with that. 00:51:12
With the mural. 00:51:17
And it'll have that side piece on it or. 00:51:18
Right if there is additional painting. 00:51:20
On the planet boxes. 00:51:23
That coincide with that, then yeah, we can talk about it. 00:51:24
OK, awesome. 00:51:27
Anybody else have any questions or concerns or anything? 00:51:29
Just for the record, I was taking pictures like crazy on Puerto Rico, so I can share those. 00:51:34
Stop stop. I need a picture. 00:51:41
OK. You guys are comfortable with moving on to the next? Yes, And this is the historical marker design? 00:51:46
Right. I don't know. I know we've. 00:51:54
Talk about this several times, yeah, but I want us to go back. 00:51:57
Not tonight. I don't want to go by this one by 1 by 1. 00:52:01
I want to if we can do this. 00:52:05
Everybody kind of go through this list and pick out their favorite 3. 00:52:07
And then we'll go down. 00:52:11
And also if you see something between now and then. 00:52:13
Go ahead and add it to this list and that can be talked about as well. Can I ask something? I know that we've had this discussion 00:52:17
at least a couple of times. 00:52:21
But with the markers, and I know this, one gentleman asked if he could go ahead and put up a. 00:52:25
A marker. 00:52:31
At his house, even though it's not. 00:52:32
Well, or if it is, but but he's not like he's right on the border, but his his house is in the. 00:52:36
The surveys ended right. 00:52:42
So and I don't think that we can really. 00:52:45
Tell him yes or no, right? No. So, so this goes. 00:52:47
To what I want to talk about and that is we had mentioned about. 00:52:52
I mean, we've got to figure out what is it, What is the history we we want to tell? 00:52:56
With Saint Mary's, as so many other towns do, so with that, that's when neighbors, I mean residents, will. 00:53:01
Then contact and say. 00:53:09
You know, I want my house to have the historic marker. This is the reason why I've got a story to tell. But we've got to know what 00:53:11
that story is and then the city grants. 00:53:17
Whether they pay for it and then it. 00:53:22
Gets on maybe a historic tour. 00:53:25
And then if somebody wants a historic marker. 00:53:28
I mean, we can't tell them not to get one, but it can't be what is. 00:53:31
Given out and approved to be in that historic story. So I think we kind of need to know that. 00:53:35
So like if this gentleman wants to but. 00:53:42
It can't be the same as the official historic Saint Mary's story. 00:53:44
Right. If he wanted to become part of the district, that's something we could talk about. Yeah, maybe. Maybe he's got something 00:53:51
with his house to share. I know which house. Yeah. I remember when they renovated that. 00:53:57
But umm. 00:54:03
Yeah, but I mean, not everybody can just. 00:54:04
Have a historic. 00:54:08
District St. Mary's House. 00:54:10
I mean, Marker, it's got to be part of the story if somebody's coming to take a tour of Saint Mary's. 00:54:12
Right for the ones in the district. 00:54:20
Right. 00:54:23
So that's all I wanted to say, yeah. 00:54:24
The same. My gosh, yeah. But if they wanted to put up a marker, that's fine if you're not in the district. 00:54:28
It shouldn't be the same because you're not part of that. 00:54:33
History. 00:54:36
Saint Mary's and how? 00:54:38
The historic district came to be right? Exactly yes. 00:54:39
That's just my thought. That's a good thought. 00:54:45
Anybody else? What else you are thinking? 00:54:48
Well, I have a question here. So you're saying if someone wants a stroke, a marker? 00:54:51
That's OK, but it shouldn't look the same as the other historical markers. 00:54:57
No, not in the district. 00:55:00
Doesn't matter if you're registered in the survey that was done back in 2000. 00:55:03
That would be 1 marker. That would be 1000. 00:55:08
This guy's house is in it. 00:55:13
Is listed in the survey. 00:55:15
But that he deserves. He deserves the full marker. 00:55:17
Right. Well, so I think that's if he wants to be part of the district, right. Oh, he's that's right. He's not in the district, OK. 00:55:20
OK, So doesn't really matter. I mean for like an outsider, they don't know where the boundaries are everything they just want to 00:55:29
put such historical. 00:55:32
Health. I think it might be nice that everything was just kind of cooked. 00:55:36
Just kind of cohesive. 00:55:40
But uh. 00:55:42
But but it's like my neighbor, which you know, her house was built in the 80s. Should she have a historic marker she's with? 00:55:43
I think we need to have the story of historic St. Mary. OK, it's my 1980s neighbors house. She's in the historic district, but 00:55:50
what story does she have to tell? 00:55:55
The house doesn't. It has nothing to do with historic Saint Mary's. Maybe she'll go up for approval. Well, yeah. Oh, absolutely. I 00:56:01
mean. 00:56:05
Well, yeah, but I think we have to come up with, and I'm saying story. I don't know what else to call it, but it's like. 00:56:10
What deems historic St. Mary? 00:56:17
That somebody comes to Saint Mary's and they want to find out the history. 00:56:20
Yeah, of downtown Saint Mary's, whatever that may be. I think we kind of need to figure what that is. 00:56:24
And then say, I think I can be a part of this. And then they send that and it's like, I'm sorry, but no, I mean. 00:56:30
You have nothing to do with the founding or with the Civil War era or whatever it is. Kelly. I think the wording that we're 00:56:37
looking for is what is the historic significance that lends itself to the town? I think, and it's thank you. I mean the but it's 00:56:42
in the ordinance that says these houses have been designated because of their historical nature and what and what lends itself to 00:56:47
that. 00:56:52
And that, but you know, the older our town becomes. 00:56:58
The more homes become. 00:57:01
Year wise qualify as historic. But then you ask yourself. 00:57:03
What, what do they, what lends themselves to the significance of it? I mean, are, are they a certain neoclassical or are they a 00:57:08
certain this or that? And if they're a brick ranch, then that's that's where you have to sort of start to delineate between those, 00:57:15
right. So even though in the 1986 and the the more recent one, it says 50 years. 00:57:22
Is the mark well? 00:57:29
I mean, that really doesn't mean anything. I think that's why we have to be more specific and say it's not. 00:57:31
50 years and then everything's historic. It's. 00:57:38
What? Umm. 00:57:41
Is the significance of Saint Mary's. 00:57:42
And the story that if somebody's traveling from. 00:57:46
Connecticut to come to Saint Mary's and they want to find out the history and kind of like Celinda said with the QR code, then 00:57:49
everything's time. I mean, gosh, you go through so many Saint Augustine, so many different Charleston. 00:57:55
You can find out what the story is and there are the. 00:58:03
The Historic. 00:58:06
Markers given by the HPC. 00:58:08
The city that designate this is a house. 00:58:12
That has a story to tell. 00:58:17
And not just because it just hit the 50 year. 00:58:20
Right. Maybe it'd be helpful to have a year too, like anything we. 00:58:23
For 1930 or? 00:58:28
Whatever. Umm. 00:58:30
But yeah, I would have to have all the information. I mean, that's something. Again, we or someone can, I mean, if we but but 00:58:31
that's for when we. 00:58:35
Right. And we have a list of those homes. Those homes are identified in a registry and those would be the people that would get 00:58:39
the historic significant home. 00:58:44
I mean, I think there should be two kinds of signs, one that says it's a historically designated. 00:58:48
Sign from the registry and another that it's in the historic district. It is a building in the district and for cost effectiveness 00:58:54
there should be two signs and they when they start to get detailed that says this is the Captain Morse sign from, you know, from 00:59:00
the 19. 00:59:05
Those get into the $500 range easily. And then we we don't have any consistency with the signs. I think there should just be two 00:59:11
signs you're either you're. 00:59:17
You're part of the registry, the Saint Mary's Historic Preservation Registry, or you're in the historic district, and the historic 00:59:23
district ones would be purchased by the people requesting them if approved, and the others, I believe, should be given to those 00:59:28
homeowners because of their. 00:59:34
Their duties that they have to preserve these homes. Yeah, I agree 100%, Julia. 00:59:40
Right. 00:59:47
As most people know, federal grant, right? 00:59:48
Hard to come in now. What if they have both? 00:59:50
Well. 00:59:54
I would ask that instead of us going through all of these tonight, would you mind? 01:00:00
If we went through all of those and you numbered them 12345, whatever they are, and then we could give you our top three numbers 01:00:06
if that would be OK. Yeah, that's great. 01:00:11
This group can approve. Can't agree on anything tonight. I can. Yeah. This is the first time I can see you ordering pizza tonight 01:00:16
for us. This is the first time. 01:00:21
Right. OK, let's. 01:00:26
Right, keep it moving and on the other right, and thank you for that. 01:00:27
So, OK, good. I think, you know, kind of restructure this OK, numerical value. 01:00:32
Associated with them with this kind of code from there. 01:00:41
So maybe, you know, I think there's a really good possibility that we're going to agree on the next one. 01:00:44
We're going to what I think there's a really. 01:00:49
High possibility that we're going to agree on the next one. 01:00:52
To adjourn the meeting, yeah. 01:00:54
I make a motion to adjourn the meeting. 01:00:56
I second. 01:00:59
All in favor say aye. 01:01:00
See. Look, we got. 01:01:02
Thank you. 01:01:05
That's, that's democracy, man. Like, you know, you don't have to. 01:01:07
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Document list

Documents available for this event
Document Name Document type
Schoychid-213 E Weed St General Document
Kraken-122 Osborne St Site B- Packet General Document
Purple Door Bridal and Prom- 100 Osborne St Unit B General Document
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Transcript

Event transcript
OK. 00:00:02
Oh no. 00:00:05
Yep, city. 00:00:09
OK, it's time. 00:00:14
All right. 00:00:16
Person in public. 00:00:19
Remind me if I mess it up. 00:00:23
All right. 00:00:25
All right. Good evening. Welcome to the 27 May 2025 historic preservation. 00:00:33
Council meeting. 00:00:38
We just want to make sure our mice are turned on, so everybody just make sure your mics are turned on. 00:00:40
Yep. And then we'll do a roll call and we'll start left to right. 00:00:45
Kelly Knapp. 00:00:49
Melvin Taylor, Julie McCullough, Scott Duo Voice. 00:00:51
All right, it looks like we have a quorum for tonight. 00:00:56
And the first thing that we need to do is. 00:01:00
I just want to make sure they there were no comments from the city or if there were, then we can we can go ahead and. 00:01:05
Work through this. 00:01:10
Not at this moment. We just make sure we need to approve the minutes from now. 00:01:12
Yes, absolutely so. 00:01:15
Of the city, we need to approve the minutes from from the last meeting from March 20. 00:01:18
I'm sorry. 25 March 2025. 00:01:23
So we received that e-mail in our packets. 00:01:26
So can I have a motion please? 00:01:28
I'll make the motion to approve the minutes. 00:01:33
I second. 00:01:36
OK, well, did you? 00:01:37
Have any questions on them? No no no no, I was lost in thoughts. OK awesome. Yep I am too, always. 00:01:40
OK, all in favor say aye. 00:01:45
All right. So that's unanimous. 00:01:48
All right, so old business. So we have the purple door. 00:01:52
So, 100 Osborne St. 00:01:56
Unit B and they're requesting new outdoor signage. 00:01:58
And the property is designated historic. So the first thing we're going to do is. 00:02:02
Just hear from the city 1st. 00:02:05
And then we're going to hear from you, ma'am. 00:02:07
Yeah. 00:02:10
Really only thing from the city is that we would like to see some more detail which what the sign is going to look like. 00:02:12
And I don't think you're going to be able to have. 00:02:19
Two of those large signs out front, I think you're just going to have to have how many entrances or? 00:02:22
Into your building. How many do you have? Actually, before we do that, can you come up and state your name and your address? 00:02:28
No, it's not that bad. Like, seriously. 00:02:33
Is definitely not that bad. 00:02:36
Tracy O'Brien. 00:02:40
Three years, yes. 00:02:42
Oh, is your mic on? 00:02:44
The reason is we typically have a couple of 1000 people on video. I'm joking around about that. I'm sure it's not a couple 1000. 00:02:51
Right. So the sign I have up there now is like a just a plastic sign. 00:02:57
I want to do an aluminum sign. There's one on the. I don't know what side that would be. 00:03:05
What is that facing? 00:03:09
I have one on both sides. 00:03:11
Yes. 00:03:14
So the one. 00:03:16
Facing Osborne would probably be the one that I would keep because that one gets a lot more attention. 00:03:18
Agree with that. Yeah. And it's just going to be aluminum. 00:03:24
An aluminum sign 3 foot by three foot. And then I was thinking because I have another store up north in Lowell IN which I'm sure 00:03:27
you know of. Oh yeah, in my store there has it's framed in with like a wood purple. 00:03:34
I don't know. 00:03:42
It's basically if you see, if you look at it. 00:03:43
Sorry if you go back up. 00:03:46
Yeah, kind of like that where it would have like a purple frame around it and it would be an actual aluminum sign. Right now it's 00:03:49
just like a. 00:03:53
Vinyl sign The only thing that I worry about up there is the wind is really strong. 00:03:57
I mean, I'm sure if it's enforced and it's up there it'll be fine, but. 00:04:06
That's kind of this would be facing. 00:04:09
The water, it would be the other side that I guess if I can't do 2 then I would do the one that's facing seagulls. 00:04:12
So I think like from here, I think. 00:04:19
What I would like to do is like here from the city. 00:04:21
Hear from anybody from the audience and then we will discuss it. 00:04:23
And like the goal is like. 00:04:27
To get it to yes and like just let you know exactly. 00:04:29
What we need to do the meant to make that 100% right 'cause. 00:04:33
We're not about wasting anybody's time. We want to make sure that we get this taken care of. 00:04:36
So I will go back, we'll go to the city 1st and she's up here so. 00:04:40
Like we're just talking about the placement of 1 sign and you can also put a sign above your door, your main entry. 00:04:45
Door 6 inches by 18 inches OK If you if you choose to do 6 inches by 18 inches, OK. 00:04:52
Yeah, I would probably do that. That'd be fine. 00:05:00
Like I was telling him my lease is up in October there I'm already because Camden County is so big because I do prom and bridal. 00:05:03
Oh yeah. 00:05:07
Camden County so big I'm almost like grown out of that spot already. 00:05:11
OK, I'm most likely going to try to get another location so. 00:05:14
I don't want to do too much. 00:05:19
I understand, you know, to their building. Yeah. Actually like, is he like keeping that location and then and then going getting a 00:05:21
second location or kind of moving away from that one, something bigger? OK. So getting leaving that location and going into 00:05:26
something different. I'd like to stay in Saint Mary's because I do like St. Mary's, Yeah. 00:05:31
It's just identifying a bigger spot, and that's kind of an odd spot being up there. People find me because they're looking for me. 00:05:38
But I don't want to do, you know, they find because that's what they're looking for. 00:05:44
But I'm OK with just doing the one sign and then one over the door. That's fine. Is the sign OK though? 00:05:49
It is, do you think? 00:05:54
Order reform. It talks about being acrylic right? 00:05:57
Acrylic acrylic are going to be. 00:06:01
I could do either one. 00:06:05
So we're going to wrap this up in a bowl too as well. 00:06:07
You know, to make sure, like before you leave here, it's like, OK, this is kind of what it looks like. We try to do that. So it's 00:06:11
not like you're leaving here and you're like, well, I don't even know what to do. 00:06:16
You know, I mean, so we'll make sure this is this gets good. 00:06:21
Just tell me exactly what you want me to do. Yeah. Yeah, Absolutely. Yeah. No, no, 100%. 00:06:24
Huh. Am I done now? Well, actually, no. 00:06:29
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:06:32
Just a little bit longer. 00:06:33
Reason why the city kind of get through there is that we'll. 00:06:39
And then we'll ask a couple of questions 1.8. 00:06:44
And aluminum single sided. 00:06:47
So from us, I think we're probably OK with it unless you guys needed to see something. 00:06:55
I think that. 00:07:00
I think when we spoke. 00:07:02
Is this one OK? When we spoke last month or maybe even the month before, one of the things that we were hoping to see was a little 00:07:03
cohesiveness between market on the square sign and your sign. There are signs really bold and in the right. 00:07:11
Look and then yours is not, not anywhere. 00:07:19
Close to what they've got. I'm not asking you to mimic theirs exactly. The other thing, and I'm I'm a school teacher, so it's a 00:07:23
pet peeve of mine. There's no apostrophe in Saint Mary's. It's just Marys. And so that's really important if we're going to. 00:07:29
God's laughing at me because he sees it from me all the time, you know, and to me you've. That's a great store. And I love the 00:07:37
purple door idea, it just seems like. 00:07:42
Your your the lettering is really, really small and you know, you worry so much about people being able to find you. That would 00:07:47
probably just be something was the D. 00:07:52
Divine store that's across the way that you know, we had that conversation with them because they've got Louisa bookstore and 00:07:58
their store and so they kind of made the the. 00:08:04
The signs where they were a little more cohesive and matched one another. So I don't know if that's something that you could look 00:08:10
to do. Obviously, you don't want to spend a lot of money if you're moving. 00:08:15
Right, Yeah, definitely something. But I mean I'm not opposed to the aluminum at all. To me the size is sort of big hanging where 00:08:20
it's hanging. I think if there were some other places that it was it was put, it might be better. But regardless, just the 00:08:26
apostrophe in Saint Mary's and. 00:08:32
Maybe just a little more cohesive with market on this square and I want to also bring the conversation back a little bit too. Just 00:08:38
play devil's advocate is like. 00:08:42
You know, is this something that we're willing to like, approve, like? 00:08:46
If she like, if you're like 80% sure you're gonna move or 90% sure you're gonna move. 00:08:50
Just so you're not investing a ton into it. 00:08:54
That we may be able to approve something potentially till that time. 00:08:57
Frame where was she moves to should be able to take. OK, that's very true. 00:09:00
OK. 00:09:06
Right. OK, OK. Yeah. 00:09:07
Yeah, I would like to add to what Julia said, which. 00:09:10
Agree, but. 00:09:14
I think the. 00:09:17
The issue I have is not only does it contrast, I love the purple door. I mean that is just just great. 00:09:19
But it is again. 00:09:27
With the market on the square and that old timey, the more of the historic look. 00:09:30
That sign? 00:09:35
Being up there really bright and bold, but more than that hanging over the rails and I think, you know, just going back and 00:09:37
looking at the codes. 00:09:41
There is. There are specifics about. You don't cover up any detail. 00:09:46
Of the of the structured. 00:09:51
Let me find where this is. It says the. 00:09:55
The proposed material change in appearance would not have a substantial adverse effect on the aesthetic, historical, or 00:10:00
architectural significance and value. 00:10:05
In the historic district and also signs must not distract or detract from the visual historic character. 00:10:10
Of the Saint Mary's Historic District and shall not obscure architectural details of the building and property. 00:10:18
So I'm thinking that. 00:10:25
Is an example of what? 00:10:29
They're talking about but. 00:10:32
I mean, can it go above? Can it be? 00:10:35
Yeah. Could it be hung above those steps and maybe I know you're worried about the wind. 00:10:39
But from the top and then from the bottom, so you wouldn't have that worry. 00:10:45
Yeah, I could move it down to like where it would be. 00:10:51
Attached, I guess, to the bottom there and then to the building. Yeah, or even above, above the steel rail. 00:10:55
Oh, like way up on the. 00:11:04
OK, gotcha. Yeah. 00:11:06
It's just, I mean, they're almost. 00:11:08
Fighting with each other. 00:11:10
Because they are different looks. It's hard because if I put it down, then people are going inside. Yeah, I know. Yeah. 00:11:12
And if we put it too high, people, then it's hard to see. I know it's really awkward. So when saying this, I'm just yeah, it's 00:11:22
it's really awkward. 00:11:26
This is a good discussion and I like obviously we're not, you know, we're. 00:11:30
You know, we all come together and I think that. 00:11:34
There's a lot of good ideas here, so. 00:11:37
I guess my question to the board would be like in the city as well is like. 00:11:39
Can we get to a yesterday? 00:11:42
And if so, then what does she need to do to get to that? Yes. 00:11:44
I've already said what I think that. 00:11:50
Needs to be done from the city's perspective, yeah. 00:11:52
It needs to come down to. 00:11:56
One large sign and one sign above the door. 00:11:57
OK, so one large sign, one sign above the door. 00:12:00
OK, I agree with Julia with the font. Maybe if you change the font to look a little bit more historic. 00:12:03
But the location? 00:12:11
I think that's. 00:12:13
The best place for. 00:12:15
As far as safety with the wind as well. 00:12:17
And people going into market on the square or being too high, you won't, you won't see it. And we really need your business to 00:12:20
succeed. 00:12:24
Yeah, it is. I just. Yeah, I just. 00:12:28
Goes against what? Yeah, what the guidelines are. But at the same time, I know it's, you know, it's. 00:12:31
You got to bring in. 00:12:37
When you don't have another option but it does get windy there and if it's swinging in the breeze it could like I would want it to 00:12:39
be. 00:12:42
Adhered to quickly the contract. I mean, I think the contractor, whoever installed would know best how to do that if we did. 00:12:46
Move it down to that level. 00:12:54
Well, I can work on the font and putting my apostrophe in which I didn't even. I just made it so quickly alarm. 00:12:55
Again. Plus I would date where they they can read it a little bit better probably too from a distance. 00:13:03
OK, so do we. So I guess we're now we're getting more granular here. 00:13:08
Do we so is there expectation that? 00:13:14
You know, obviously one sign and then one sign above the door. 00:13:17
So we were there. 00:13:19
And then? 00:13:21
Location wise, can we spend a little bit more time on that, another minute or two? Yeah, on location, I just don't like the look. 00:13:22
So let's nail that down and then we'll and then we'll actually talk about the font. 00:13:29
And then we'll go. We'll kind of give. 00:13:33
You know, wrap that up in about. 00:13:36
So location. 00:13:39
So it sounds like we have a little bit of a. 00:13:41
I know. 00:13:43
That's why I'm kind of thinking, yeah. 00:13:46
Yeah. 00:13:49
Like right on Osborne St. if anything came open and that would be my main goal, yeah. 00:13:51
Yeah, the location covering up the bells. 00:13:56
But again, that is the best place as far as. 00:14:00
Not worrying about the. 00:14:04
And safety for and and the safety with that. 00:14:06
But also. 00:14:09
The look of marking on the square which? 00:14:11
The background. 00:14:14
Kind of melts in with the color of the building with that yellowish cream. 00:14:16
And then you've got that with the historic look, and then there's yours, and it's almost like a spotlight. 00:14:22
And there's such a contrast. 00:14:29
In the two. 00:14:31
That it looks like it was just and it's a beautiful. I mean, I love what you did with that. I mean, I like the purple. I like the 00:14:34
purple door. 00:14:37
Brighton and prom. I mean, it's just really. 00:14:41
Really hard. 00:14:44
Doing it the same color as their building. 00:14:46
Yeah, they're building. 00:14:50
Yeah. It's the location that I think that's it. 00:14:51
So with their respects, so can we. 00:14:55
Again, we don't obviously have to vote together on this page. 00:14:58
You could do. 00:15:01
For it or like a softer light or something that can make all the difference, yeah. 00:15:03
Yeah. 00:15:08
Maybe make it a? 00:15:09
Not so white. 00:15:11
Yeah. So let's go back to location really fast before we go to find. So like. 00:15:14
Location wise, can we? 00:15:19
Give her some direction on that. 00:15:22
I think the location is the best place where she has. 00:15:25
As far as visual and safety. 00:15:30
We are coming up on hurricane season if it's blowing in the wind. 00:15:34
It gets so windy down there. 00:15:38
I just. 00:15:41
Yeah. OK. So we so OK, so location is there. 00:15:43
And then the font. 00:15:46
So we kind of talked about that a little bit. 00:15:48
Maybe a darker tone? 00:15:50
Darker color. 00:15:52
Is that what we're kind of looking at right now? 00:15:53
OK. And does anybody know what that is? 00:15:56
No, but we can find out definitely. 00:16:01
Yeah, just search through, right? Yeah. Oh yeah. 00:16:05
So can you all let her know where that is? 00:16:09
And then and then we can kind of give probably at this point we probably need a little reworking of the sign and everything before 00:16:11
we approve it. I mean, I hate to delay you again on this, but. 00:16:16
Yeah, just. 00:16:22
We're almost there. So I think, yeah, we're almost there. So we like, we have to like. 00:16:27
We're like here. 00:16:31
We table it. 00:16:33
Why should we be able to? 00:16:35
Work on these changes that we're asking for. 00:16:37
Yeah, no, absolutely. 00:16:39
OK, so that's what and then? 00:16:41
I just wanted to see if there's any. 00:16:43
Anybody from the audience that would love to come up in comment about this? 00:16:45
Sorry. OK, that was kind of weird. The wording was bad. 00:16:49
Would anybody like to come up and say anything about the sign? 00:16:54
OK. All right. 00:16:58
So do you have any, Do you have enough guys? Do you have any questions for us? 00:17:00
We want to make this as simple as possible. We don't want to be like. 00:17:03
Where it doesn't blend also but it doesn't pop as much. 00:17:08
As long as you guys are fine with that because I can't really. I like, yeah. 00:17:17
Because the wind every day, even when it's not hurricane season, especially on the 2nd floor, is. 00:17:21
Yeah, can only imagine. 00:17:28
So no, I think I'm good and I'm OK with doing that. And then. 00:17:30
OK. 00:17:34
Awesome. Does anybody else have any comments up here? 00:17:35
All right. We really appreciate you. Yeah. Thank you. Oh, should we make a motion table? 00:17:38
Do you need to put a motion? 00:17:45
Table the item OK to next session. 00:17:47
Kenton. 00:17:51
We'll continue the discussion. Yeah, make a motion there, right? 00:17:52
I'll make a motion to continue the item to next month. 00:17:56
I'll second all in favor say aye. 00:18:00
Aye. 00:18:03
All righty. Thank you so much. 00:18:04
Thank you. All right, so new business, so we have. 00:18:06
A certificate of appropriateness for cracking coffee. 00:18:11
So request for Merle. 00:18:15
Of marine life to be painted on their building. 00:18:16
122 Osborne St. 00:18:19
And the properties in the historic district. 00:18:21
Do we have representative? 00:18:24
Hello, Sir. Hello. I'm Colby Claflin with Tracking Coffee and Kitchen Company at 122 Osborne, Suite B. 00:18:30
OK, awesome Sir. And we'll start with the city 1st. 00:18:38
I just wanted to see if the city had any questions. 00:18:41
Concerns. 00:18:44
We don't know. We've we've, we've looked at this. 00:18:45
Quite extensively with with staff and. 00:18:49
We like everything. It's a good idea. It's a good visual aspect for downtown. 00:18:52
OK. Any questions from the board? 00:18:56
Do you want me to start Kelly Hudson? 00:19:02
I have a couple of concerns. 00:19:07
I love Amanda. I assume this is Amanda Moore's work, Yes. 00:19:09
We have Amanda and we also have another gentleman from the local area here. 00:19:13
That is looking at painting. Definitely a big fan of her work. OK. 00:19:18
Two things, you know, we just met a second ago with the purple door and she says she may be moving from 1:00. 00:19:24
Facility to another but wants to stay in the downtown or in the Saint Mary's area. We come across this that if Kraken ever. 00:19:31
Outgrows the space and or moves. 00:19:39
We've got a large. 00:19:42
Kraken on the side of our building. 00:19:44
The second concern that I have is that this is in direct conflict with the ordinance. 00:19:47
Ordinance says exterior paintings that have to do directly with. 00:19:52
The properties business are are not appropriate for the area. That being said, somebody said well I know, but it's just a big 00:19:58
octopus. But y'all are the cracking coffee company and so if it were up to me, unfortunately I would probably tell you no on this, 00:20:04
but. 00:20:09
Yeah, and I have to concur with her simply again going back. 00:20:15
To the ordinance and. 00:20:21
You know, we like with the purple door, I mean there are some situations like with the location that. 00:20:24
That's there's the only that's the only place and I loved this. I think it's. 00:20:32
Just great. 00:20:38
But we do have to. 00:20:40
Do as much as we can to follow the guidelines. 00:20:43
And if we do that? 00:20:47
Then I mean, we're pretty much saying. 00:20:50
Whoever wants. 00:20:54
To put whatever. 00:20:55
This is beautiful, this is wonderful, but we don't know in the future. 00:20:57
Something might come up that conflicts with the. 00:21:02
The ordinance, the codes. 00:21:05
And we've already given a go ahead to something that didn't so. 00:21:08
It's hard, it's really difficult because so we to add to that. So we actually reached out to the owners of the building. 00:21:12
They agreed that it would be great. They signed the paper on that today. 00:21:21
We're on a five year lease. 00:21:26
And with the extension of five years? 00:21:28
To go along with that. And then we are taking donations to buy the building if you guys are willing and then we'll be there 00:21:30
forever. 00:21:34
So but anyways to go with that? 00:21:39
They have agreed and we just think it would be. 00:21:43
We'd have a little bit of a modification so it wouldn't look so bold on the top. 00:21:46
But with Amanda painting or the other gentleman on our local area here. 00:21:50
But it would just so there's a big following. I don't know if you guys. 00:21:56
Are aware of the big following of the butterfly wings. 00:22:00
There is 200,000 people that follow butterflies all around the world. 00:22:03
And that's where they make their travel destinations is to go to. 00:22:09
These things here and take pictures of them and post them on Facebook. This is how they make their destinations and. 00:22:13
We just thought it would be a great idea not only to do. 00:22:20
Help our business proceed forward. 00:22:24
But for the downtown Saint Mary's area to draw? 00:22:26
People down. 00:22:30
And get them excited to come down and visit downtown Saint Mary's. 00:22:31
We're all looking for that. 00:22:35
That what makes us come downtown to Saint Mary's. We've all been in that meeting. 00:22:36
We just figured that we would kind of throw this out there and we would kind of help. 00:22:41
Drive some people downtown. 00:22:46
With some great artwork from the locals. 00:22:47
Yeah, it is great artwork. 00:22:50
This guy is convincing. 00:22:53
Have you noticed? 00:22:54
Yeah, well, I mean what you're saying. 00:22:56
Is 100%. I'm a fan of your shop by the way. Thank you and. 00:22:58
The painting is beautiful, I like it, but I'm in agreement with Julia as far as. 00:23:07
Cracking coffee cracking on the. 00:23:13
On the wall, because that opens the door to we got a new pizza shop coming in. What if they want to paint a pizza on the side of 00:23:15
the building or the brewery? They wanna paint a big mug of beer on the side of the building. 00:23:22
So, you know, if we say yes to that, then we got to say yes to the others. Well, with the pizza shop, it it. 00:23:30
Already has Saint Mary's painted on the side of it. 00:23:38
Yeah, it already has a mural of Saint Mary's painted on this. Yeah, Yeah. So the pizza shop already has a mural on the side to go 00:23:40
with, you know what, if they wanted to paint a big pizza outside of the building? 00:23:46
You know, umm. 00:23:53
So what would you? What would you think of this idea? 00:23:54
So in the tentacle there. 00:23:58
We phase in. 00:24:01
The word Saint Mary's. 00:24:03
Yes, it is Marine. 00:24:08
So, so like on the like on the bottom, there were people would most likely take a picture right there by the around the window 00:24:10
there. 00:24:14
That we could actually phase into the tentacle itself. 00:24:18
That says Saint Mary's, Georgia. 00:24:21
What do you think? 00:24:26
This guy's a husband. 00:24:28
Like so just in all honesty, I didn't even know where Kraken was. 00:24:31
Like a Kraken was so the. 00:24:35
Something from that perspective. I mean, so where are we at here? So it sounds like we're at a. 00:24:38
At a stall here. 00:24:44
So are we. 00:24:46
Are we going to get to a yes here? Are we going to get to a number here? And if it's a no? 00:24:49
Then what needs to happen? 00:24:54
So I think that's kind of where we are right now. 00:24:56
Well, it's not our decision to decide what's going to happen, it's just we're voting on that. 00:24:58
Yeah, that's all. 00:25:02
That's all our job is. Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm saying like, so like. 00:25:04
How do we? 00:25:08
If it's like if we're all here and we're saying hey, like, this is not going to happen. 00:25:09
Then what does he need to do to change that? Does he need to just be something different or? Well, I think that. 00:25:14
Because the the issue is that. 00:25:20
In here it says that you cannot have a mural signed. 00:25:24
Picture that DEP. 00:25:28
Picks what the business is or. 00:25:30
What it's called in this case? 00:25:32
So I think that's the issue is there. 00:25:35
Something that. 00:25:39
Can be changed that. 00:25:41
It's not cracking. 00:25:43
So obviously the crack in. 00:25:46
Right, the cracking of the cracking coffee. So if I walk up to the screen. 00:25:48
So we take. 00:25:54
That top corner off where you're seeing the big part of the. 00:25:56
What you guys are calling the octopus or the tentacle right there, right? 00:26:00
We basically move the eye up to the corner of the square up there. 00:26:03
So it more looks like because honestly, nobody knows what a cracking looks like. 00:26:08
Yeah, that's why it's a crack and it's not an octopus. So we're we're putting it down as as. 00:26:13
That way it would look more like sea life. 00:26:18
Instead of a cracking. 00:26:21
If we took the big the octopus side of it. 00:26:23
Of the head off and moved it up a little bit and made the tentacles longer. 00:26:27
It would be, you know, that's that would be an option there. 00:26:32
Would that something like that work? 00:26:36
Well, uh. 00:26:38
I wonder, Julia, I don't know, I'm just talking here. 00:26:38
And Scott and Melvin, yeah, this is discussion. 00:26:43
But if you added. 00:26:47
More sea life. 00:26:50
Like subtle, I mean, would that or is it just the fact that? 00:26:51
It's, I mean it takes over the building, which is again. 00:26:55
Love it. It's just it's in the historic district and when you have these right. 00:27:00
But maybe. 00:27:06
Take it down, add sea life so it's more depicting. 00:27:09
Sea life, I mean, you brought that up about. 00:27:15
It doesn't look like a Kraken, it looks like sea life. 00:27:18
Would that suffice? I don't know. 00:27:21
I don't know. 00:27:24
Scott. 00:27:29
I don't know, I'm really struggling with it. I know this is because. 00:27:30
I mean like I always, I would say like my. 00:27:36
I guess my stance here would be to make it as simple as possible. 00:27:39
I mean, I think that if he like. 00:27:42
I mean, when you, when we talk about adding sea life, like, is that like adding like? 00:27:44
One or two fish. 00:27:49
Just something with us. 00:27:50
So when someone looks at it, they don't see a crack and if they know what a cracker looks like? 00:27:53
But they're seeing. 00:27:58
A mural of. 00:28:01
Umm to see since you want to have. 00:28:03
A little bit of what your business is called. 00:28:09
In there but. 00:28:13
Can't be. 00:28:15
Oh, that's the name of the business. So if I understand you correctly. 00:28:16
Are you saying that? 00:28:22
He can keep the same as Admiral like as he has right now, and then just add a couple of. 00:28:23
Sea life around it. 00:28:28
I mean. 00:28:31
That's so. 00:28:32
Because that's taking it over. But to bring it, I mean, I think our job in the historic district is for us to look at the code. 00:28:35
And the code clearly states Kelly already read it. 00:28:40
That pictures or paintings or artworks. 00:28:45
On buildings cannot depict. 00:28:50
The business that's inside. 00:28:53
That follows into that category. I mean, I think we. 00:28:55
I think it. 00:28:59
Yeah, see, I think it looks great. I mean, I think it's it's nice. I really do like it. 00:29:00
I think it adds to the building and all. 00:29:07
But my concern is. 00:29:09
That we set a precedent. 00:29:12
For others coming down the road. 00:29:14
So we really got to think about that. 00:29:17
And so with that said, I'm gonna have to vote no. 00:29:19
OK, so. 00:29:24
Public comment. 00:29:26
Yeah. So let's, let's let's go to public comment and then we'll come back to the board in the city. 00:29:27
And, umm. 00:29:31
And then we'll we'll wrap this up. 00:29:32
In a bowl like I always say. So do we have any comments from the from? 00:29:34
Anybody from the outside? 00:29:38
Oh, come on up. 00:29:40
Oh, can you? 00:29:42
He just come up because the reason is because you're on video. 00:29:44
So the everybody else I was. 00:29:47
And it was. 00:29:50
The address a difference Then could we put an octopus up there? 00:29:52
We need you to state your name and your address. I'm Kristen Claflin. I'm his wife and. 00:29:57
I'm also one of the owners. 00:30:02
For cracking. 00:30:05
But if we had a different name, could we put sea life pictures up there if our name was say? 00:30:06
I don't know. 00:30:13
If it was. 00:30:14
Or Saint Mary's coffee, Then could we put a Sea Life mural up there? 00:30:17
I think that ordinance simply says that if it. 00:30:22
If the artwork depicts. 00:30:25
The business inside, it's a no our starfish or. 00:30:28
A fish or. 00:30:34
A wave or something like that. 00:30:37
I think it would be. I mean. 00:30:39
From what I read, I think it would. 00:30:41
Because it's a Navy base. 00:30:43
But as Julia said, it's the name of the business and we're in the historic district. 00:30:46
With these, we could pick another sea creature. 00:30:51
That doesn't bother us. 00:30:57
What are you all thinking about that? 00:31:00
Do you have any suggestions of a sea creature? 00:31:02
Or maybe we could have Is it Amanda? 00:31:05
Oh, amenity. Yeah, because there's lots of manatees. 00:31:09
I mean, I think our job here is to either approve the certificate or deny it. 00:31:12
Yes. And then you can come back again with a just with a amended. 00:31:18
Certificate I think is what you probably need to Amanda. Is that her name? 00:31:23
She might even be able to drop something. I'm sure she she's very good. You guys just ahead of time, have any ideas of the sea 00:31:28
creature that you would like? I just have to come in front of us. 00:31:34
Yeah, so I would say this, I decided this last thing too is like. 00:31:40
The goal is to get to yes. 00:31:43
So I think they like, so obviously this is going to not get voted against, right? 00:31:45
But I think that if you, let's say versus, you did pick a like something that was not related to your. 00:31:50
Your organization, right? 00:31:56
It sounds like it's gonna be yes. So we're your champion. 00:31:58
But it just can't be that. OK, understandable reasons. 00:32:01
But yeah, like I think they and we'll give it ahead of time. 00:32:06
We usually get the readout like a little bit ahead. 00:32:09
A week or so ahead. 00:32:12
And, you know, and if there's some challenges there, then, you know, we can make sure that you get that information. 00:32:13
OK, so that way you're not wasting time coming back and getting it denied and coming back and getting it denied. We definitely 00:32:19
want to work with you. 00:32:22
Because we really have no. 00:32:26
I mean, it doesn't have to be. 00:32:28
A Kraken, but I think it would be neat to have something naval. 00:32:30
Being in this community, that part would be really cool. No 100%. 00:32:34
Well, at this time I'd like to. 00:32:40
Make a motion to deny the certificate of appropriateness for Kraken. 00:32:42
I second that. 00:32:46
All right, all in favor, say aye. 00:32:47
Aye, all right. 00:32:49
Thank you. No, thank you. 00:32:50
Are y'all sticking around for the? 00:32:52
The other thing on the agenda? 00:32:54
OK for the. 00:33:00
Outside seating. 00:33:01
Yeah, OK, awesome. Yeah. 00:33:03
That would be into the discussion. Yeah, in our discussion portion. 00:33:06
So the next thing we have. 00:33:10
Is distributed appropriateness for. 00:33:12
Mellon, Myrtle St. Request removal and if possible. 00:33:16
Replacing the palm trees on 213 E Weed St. 00:33:20
This property is designated in the Historic district. 00:33:24
Do we have? 00:33:26
The person. 00:33:28
Or people. 00:33:30
People, yes you can. 00:33:31
Yeah. 00:33:33
Hi, I'm Margie Shorekin from 213 E Wade St. 00:33:36
And I'm Mel Schoik at 213 E Queen St. 00:33:41
Hello. 00:33:44
All right. 00:33:47
So let me just say this that we moved here in 2016. 00:33:48
And we went. 00:33:53
To the board. 00:33:55
Probably 6 times. 00:33:56
And we complied with the city. 00:34:00
Got what we wanted, what they wanted. 00:34:03
It works. 00:34:07
OK. We appreciate definitely what the child. 00:34:08
OK. Thank you, Sir. 00:34:11
Did we describe or? Oh yeah, you can start. Yeah, absolutely. 00:34:14
I know you have. 00:34:21
One. So you want to remove this one. 00:34:25
Do you want us to read what I wrote? 00:34:31
I would just give us. 00:34:34
Some more information for the ones that you want. 00:34:36
To remove the size of them if there's if they're very small saplings like I've seen on most of your property. 00:34:39
I don't foresee that being a problem for you guys to move those. 00:34:45
Just maybe tell us how big these palm trees are, but I can't really read it. 00:34:49
OK. 00:34:54
So you have one close to Weed St. 00:34:57
So, well, one thing for sure is that we have some. 00:34:59
You call them saplings that we call them smaller ones. Yeah, they're in the Moat. 00:35:03
And we can't take those out because? 00:35:08
Well, you have a small pond like right here and right here. 00:35:11
Totaled of 24 palm trees. 00:35:15
If I've counted them all, there's 24. 00:35:17
So. 00:35:20
The two here over the Big X. 00:35:22
Those are the 2 that are. 00:35:28
If you measure 24 inches, yeah, I see 20 right here. Yeah. 00:35:31
And those are the ones. 00:35:35
And those are the reason why we. 00:35:38
Have looked at taking them out. 00:35:42
Is to help preserve the life of the big oak tree. 00:35:45
If it's already stressed from. 00:35:50
The salt water intrusion that comes in the property and it just sits there. 00:35:54
Because we're so close to the marsh and the. 00:36:00
And all that, this also takes the nutrients away from the roots, right? 00:36:03
Yeah, there's a good, that's a good photo. 00:36:08
So. 00:36:11
The one with the XS. 00:36:13
Over to the left. 00:36:15
Are these the exits inside the circles or outside the circles? 00:36:17
Let's say I'm sorry, they're just the X's. In or out means they go. 00:36:22
I thought this. 00:36:27
See this up there? This might look better. That right there is a Cities property by the way. 00:36:31
Yeah, see the line right here. 00:36:38
OK. 00:36:40
So the two. 00:36:41
The two circles with the X's inside. 00:36:43
Yes. 00:36:48
We've discussed this with the tree and yeah, and the tree board is. 00:36:50
Is on board with those being removed. 00:36:54
Actually, there are people that want it. 00:36:57
Good. Well, I think they're being. I think part of the approval from the tree board was that they'd be replanted somewhere, not 00:37:01
by. 00:37:05
If they're if they're on city property, they'll be replanted by the city. If they're yours, obviously you can. 00:37:10
That's but I just wanted to clarify. You can barely, I think right above the property owner's name. 00:37:15
Is where the division of. 00:37:22
City property and private property is somewhere right in there, right? Is that right? I think, yeah, I think you have a stake out 00:37:24
there as well. Or is that right? Yeah, Well, we cannot find, by the way. 00:37:30
We cannot find. 00:37:37
OK, I've talked to Jeff Fossum. He was supposed to. 00:37:43
Am I correct? 00:37:47
I haven't talked to him about this yet, but if he's planning on doing that then. 00:37:49
I'm sure you can see the one over here in our Moat. 00:37:53
You'll see it's very visible if you want to go by seeing. So I was going to say also like I think we can definitely start a 00:37:56
discussion up here. 00:37:59
On this because. 00:38:03
I think it's I've been past this this property. 00:38:05
So. So what do you all think? 00:38:09
Well, we have two separate matters here, right? 00:38:13
We have trees on city property. 00:38:16
And we have trees on private property and we are only here to handle the trees on the private property. The trees on the city 00:38:19
property will be handled by the tree board and that's already happened. 00:38:24
OK, perfect. That's already I'm in our meeting last month. 00:38:30
Yes, Sir. 00:38:35
The property on the city property. Cabinet palms on the city property. 00:38:36
Is going where? 00:38:42
Say that one more time. 00:38:44
He wants to know the cat, the cat's bombs. 00:38:46
On the city property. 00:38:49
That you want removed. 00:38:50
Removed because of because of the oak tree. 00:38:53
If those are going where? 00:38:55
That is, that is on behalf probably I'm going to. 00:38:57
I'm going to put Bobby Maher in charge of that, right. We'll have to figure out. We don't know yet. Yeah, we have some. 00:39:01
Right. But that's that I think the tree board said that if they are replanted on city property, then we would approve it. So it's 00:39:07
not a we're going to pull them out and give them to other people that they're going to be that they're going to be. 00:39:14
Moved to another location on city property. 00:39:20
That's between Taj and Bobby Mars. 00:39:25
So then the ones that we're looking at tonight on his private property, 123, Yeah. So, so anytime you all want to come by, right? 00:39:32
And I have been out here. 00:39:43
Jody, he has determined that these larger palm trees are interfering with the oak tree. 00:39:47
And its water consumption levels so that they need to go. 00:39:53
But again, that's a. That's a. 00:39:58
City property and the tree boards things, those aren't the cabbage ponds that we're talking about. The pumps that we're talking 00:40:00
about tonight don't have on his property with the oak tree. So let's just to clarify, is that right now? Oh yeah. 00:40:05
Yeah. 00:40:11
I know I don't think so. 00:40:12
So. So it sounds like just a bit less just to wrap this up. 00:40:15
So it sounds like the. 00:40:19
This portion of it. 00:40:21
It sounds like the city. The trees on the city property are good. They're going to be taken out. 00:40:22
They're already taken care of. 00:40:29
We need to the ones on the private property are the ones that we have to vote on right now. 00:40:31
So we can. So does anybody, Is anybody against the trees coming off the property? I have no problem. 00:40:35
Is there any stipulation of like them being replanted somewhere or so then they can. Those are the ones that you can give away to 00:40:43
anybody because they're on your property. It's your responsibility to to. 00:40:49
Have that taken care of too? That's not OK. OK, OK, so. 00:40:55
Do we have any discussion from outside? 00:41:00
Is there? OK? So what we'll do is. 00:41:03
We have one more person. 00:41:06
Coming up. 00:41:08
OK, umm. 00:41:09
So so. 00:41:10
So with that said. 00:41:13
It sounds like. 00:41:15
There's really no discussion on it, so it sounds like. 00:41:17
If we do vote yes, they you'll just have to have somebody just come out and remove those and then you can do whatever. 00:41:21
You want with him. 00:41:25
For the most part. 00:41:26
Down or replant them. 00:41:28
Yes, correct. Yes. 00:41:30
Stays on a We appreciate everything you've done. He's a pretty good guy. 00:41:32
Thank you so much. So let's do we have a motion for it? 00:41:38
I make a motion to approve the removal of the cabbage palms on Melon Murdie's property. 00:41:42
I make a motion to 2nd. 00:41:49
All in favor say aye. 00:41:51
Aye, all right. 00:41:53
Easy day. 00:41:55
Yes, that was really beautiful. 00:41:57
So the so the first discussion that we have. 00:42:01
Is umm. 00:42:05
Outdoor dining. 00:42:08
At 122 Osborne St. 00:42:10
For the cracking coffee. 00:42:14
I know this is something we've been having we've had in the works for a while. 00:42:16
And then we've been trying to, you know, kind of talking through. 00:42:19
So we're just going to dive right in. 00:42:22
From a city perspective, we think this is a great idea to use it right away. 00:42:27
And we definitely encourage this. 00:42:32
Yeah, and I've also had a couple of. 00:42:34
It sounds like the city council's on board. I've had a couple of City Councilman. 00:42:36
Reach out to me about it. I don't know if they've reached out to you all about it, but. 00:42:40
Yeah. 00:42:45
Yeah, I've had to. 00:42:46
They reached out to me about it. 00:42:49
So it sounds like there might be some some. 00:42:51
A little push there and. 00:42:55
A little support there for that. 00:42:57
So let's jump into the discussion. 00:42:59
I think everyone knows that I really love the idea. 00:43:02
Of the parklets, we've seen them used. 00:43:06
Throughout the country, internationally, I mean, they just. 00:43:09
There's such a draw. 00:43:13
Just bring. 00:43:16
Energy, I think it kind of keeps a pathway going when you have that. 00:43:17
I know that there are some safety issues, but I've read. 00:43:23
And I guess a lot of it depends on what you have, but if they have, you know, with the studies. 00:43:26
The amount of space, whether it's. 00:43:31
And even adding like bollards or plant. 00:43:33
Planners that are filled with water. I mean there are so many different ways to. 00:43:38
To increase the safety and. 00:43:43
So I personally. 00:43:46
Like the idea I. 00:43:49
I like it. And are we voting on? We're not voting on, just like we're asking. 00:43:51
Your blessing on this gotcha. OK, this we're moving to City Council. 00:43:55
And see what they have to say. Absolutely. 00:43:59
OK, so there's no bow here. It's just, hey, we agree with it. 00:44:02
Right. I mean, or could we vote on it or? 00:44:07
OK. So Nova, OK. 00:44:10
I mean, this is about the fourth time that this has been on our agenda and. 00:44:11
All four times we've had discussions of positive things and negative things, and I directly asked Jamie Stein, the head of. 00:44:16
Of the department. 00:44:24
Were we approving this or they just asking for a blessing as she said it was already a done deal and we can go back and look at 00:44:26
the tapes that she's asking for. 00:44:30
Our blessing on this. 00:44:35
I've received an e-mail from Jeremy Nassimanto, one of the City Council people, and I was very concerned about the idea that he 00:44:37
sort of. 00:44:41
And these are my words that he sort of brushed off that lawsuit with Milton that was a devastating event that happened. And we 00:44:47
have huge traffic problems down there. And, and as far as I'm concerned, the crack and coffee side of it isn't the problem is when 00:44:54
we open that other side up to a a brewery. 00:45:01
And they're not serving coffee. And there's going to be people, whether you like it or not. We've seen it in Saint Mary's. They're 00:45:09
going to take that beer and go, oh, there's a friend of mine and they're going to walk across that street to the other ones. 00:45:14
I love the idea. I wish that they would have looked at it for Stable Alley. 00:45:21
Instead of our main drag out there, I'm just, I think about a little over 5 weeks ago, Mark on the square got hit by a car. 00:45:25
Hit by a car and then Mr. Nassimanto said, well, you know, the speed limit is 25 and, and Milton happened in the area, that's 45. 00:45:34
We've seen speed limits. They don't know. People don't pay attention to speed limits down there. 00:45:41
The median is tight. 00:45:47
The parking is tight. I love the idea of this parklet. I think it's in the wrong place and it won't. It will not receive my 00:45:50
blessing same day. 00:45:54
Sure enough. 00:46:00
Anybody else? 00:46:03
Everything that Julie said, I agree with. I think it's a huge liability. 00:46:04
Market on the Square was just hit not too long ago. The tree down the street gets hit frequently. I just. 00:46:10
Think it's a big liability for the city? 00:46:17
Being being, you know it's going to be cracking spa. 00:46:20
But who's going to be responsible if somebody gets hurt? Is it going to be the city because it's a city right away? Or is it going 00:46:25
to be cracking? 00:46:29
I just those are those are some items that we're working out with this city attorney right now. 00:46:33
I just think it's a liability and I don't think us having a an insurance policy is. 00:46:38
Is that thing that makes it all OK? 00:46:44
Because we don't want to use that insurance policy when something devastating happens. Our downtown is for kid friendly. 00:46:46
It parents and. 00:46:53
Adults are going to be over it at Brackish Beer and the kids are going to be outside the parklets and they're going to be standing 00:46:56
right, right up against the area where. 00:47:01
They are allowed or aren't allowed and I just, I see something devastating, so I'm on the record. 00:47:06
Are there any safety features that are? 00:47:11
Being talked about and planned. 00:47:15
Aren't going anywhere. 00:47:18
Let's install those. 00:47:20
And Julian did send over a picture of a bollard, right? Yeah, they that's used. 00:47:21
Now those planners are not permanent. That was one of the huge, big selling points that when Jamie and. 00:47:28
Kansas presented this to us, that those would be movable. 00:47:34
Would be movable planters or concrete pieces, whatever they were. 00:47:38
So, I mean, I understand that the city, you know, the, the council's on board. I think it's, I think it could be catastrophic. 00:47:44
I actually need a different direction on it. 00:47:51
I think that. 00:47:54
I think the. 00:47:56
I think these things are well studied. I think they like really. 00:47:58
From my perspective, I don't really. 00:48:02
Look at this, I look at the safety portion of it, but. 00:48:05
I think if the city does their due diligence and they look at it and they go. 00:48:08
Hey, like if the impact is 40 miles, 45 miles an hour? 00:48:11
That you're still safe based on the. 00:48:15
You know, like the the protection or whatever. 00:48:17
Because like, I mean, I've been in these a lot and there's been traffic going 50-60 miles an hour. 00:48:20
On the side of me. 00:48:25
And I felt pretty safe with the setup. 00:48:26
And I like accidents do happen, but I just don't see. 00:48:31
If you set up the right way and I think if it's under the supervision of. 00:48:36
The city. 00:48:39
They you know, it could, it could it can work. 00:48:40
The one thing that I did want to bring up too was, and this is kind of way off the subject. 00:48:44
Is if it does get implemented. I saw there was like an extension of. 00:48:48
The painting. 00:48:54
Into that portion. 00:48:55
So is that something that we would have to? 00:48:57
Approved. Here they come back. 00:49:00
The rendition. 00:49:04
I think that can be talked about at that time too, yeah. 00:49:05
So this kind of my stance on it, I mean. 00:49:09
What do you think? 00:49:11
I because I'm. 00:49:13
I just got back from Puerto Rico actually, where they had a lot of those. 00:49:16
And they drive crazy though. 00:49:20
Yeah, but. 00:49:22
There didn't seem to be a problem at all, people just feel like why as it was. 00:49:24
As if it was just an extension of the store and stuff and it just added so much to the aesthetic that. 00:49:28
I'm for it and I just figure. 00:49:34
Sure, there's always. 00:49:37
The, you know, possibility that SO is going to be crazy. 00:49:39
Drive into it or whatever or but, but that's like with anything anyway. Yeah, that could be in a building too. 00:49:43
Yeah, it sounds so. It sounds like we have a house divided on it. 00:49:50
But. 00:49:54
Discussion, Yeah, it's only for discussion, right? So the house is divided on it, but. 00:49:55
So we have, we have you on record your opinion so that. Yeah. 00:49:59
Consideration with City Council. 00:50:04
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. But I think it's a great idea. Yeah. Can I add one more thing and this is? 00:50:05
You know, with the safety concern and I know they've got the planners. 00:50:11
Which is. 00:50:15
The norm. 00:50:16
Safety. 00:50:21
Feature whether it's a bollard but. 00:50:22
For that to be the external feature, to be the sight line when somebody is driving. So that comes you know, and I think there are 00:50:27
actually. 00:50:32
In different studies, different the amount of space that. 00:50:38
They have found that work. So I mean if they can take that into consideration. 00:50:42
Without any extra safety features. 00:50:47
OK. 00:50:49
So my last question would be another here right now in the audience like what's next steps? 00:50:52
At this point, we'll send you over for City Council. 00:50:57
OK, so like the next meeting? 00:51:00
He'll be the next meeting, but. 00:51:02
That is the plan. OK, gotcha. OK. So then once they and then just offer more clarification on our side if the City Council does 00:51:04
approve it. 00:51:08
Then they'll just come back to us with that. 00:51:12
With the mural. 00:51:17
And it'll have that side piece on it or. 00:51:18
Right if there is additional painting. 00:51:20
On the planet boxes. 00:51:23
That coincide with that, then yeah, we can talk about it. 00:51:24
OK, awesome. 00:51:27
Anybody else have any questions or concerns or anything? 00:51:29
Just for the record, I was taking pictures like crazy on Puerto Rico, so I can share those. 00:51:34
Stop stop. I need a picture. 00:51:41
OK. You guys are comfortable with moving on to the next? Yes, And this is the historical marker design? 00:51:46
Right. I don't know. I know we've. 00:51:54
Talk about this several times, yeah, but I want us to go back. 00:51:57
Not tonight. I don't want to go by this one by 1 by 1. 00:52:01
I want to if we can do this. 00:52:05
Everybody kind of go through this list and pick out their favorite 3. 00:52:07
And then we'll go down. 00:52:11
And also if you see something between now and then. 00:52:13
Go ahead and add it to this list and that can be talked about as well. Can I ask something? I know that we've had this discussion 00:52:17
at least a couple of times. 00:52:21
But with the markers, and I know this, one gentleman asked if he could go ahead and put up a. 00:52:25
A marker. 00:52:31
At his house, even though it's not. 00:52:32
Well, or if it is, but but he's not like he's right on the border, but his his house is in the. 00:52:36
The surveys ended right. 00:52:42
So and I don't think that we can really. 00:52:45
Tell him yes or no, right? No. So, so this goes. 00:52:47
To what I want to talk about and that is we had mentioned about. 00:52:52
I mean, we've got to figure out what is it, What is the history we we want to tell? 00:52:56
With Saint Mary's, as so many other towns do, so with that, that's when neighbors, I mean residents, will. 00:53:01
Then contact and say. 00:53:09
You know, I want my house to have the historic marker. This is the reason why I've got a story to tell. But we've got to know what 00:53:11
that story is and then the city grants. 00:53:17
Whether they pay for it and then it. 00:53:22
Gets on maybe a historic tour. 00:53:25
And then if somebody wants a historic marker. 00:53:28
I mean, we can't tell them not to get one, but it can't be what is. 00:53:31
Given out and approved to be in that historic story. So I think we kind of need to know that. 00:53:35
So like if this gentleman wants to but. 00:53:42
It can't be the same as the official historic Saint Mary's story. 00:53:44
Right. If he wanted to become part of the district, that's something we could talk about. Yeah, maybe. Maybe he's got something 00:53:51
with his house to share. I know which house. Yeah. I remember when they renovated that. 00:53:57
But umm. 00:54:03
Yeah, but I mean, not everybody can just. 00:54:04
Have a historic. 00:54:08
District St. Mary's House. 00:54:10
I mean, Marker, it's got to be part of the story if somebody's coming to take a tour of Saint Mary's. 00:54:12
Right for the ones in the district. 00:54:20
Right. 00:54:23
So that's all I wanted to say, yeah. 00:54:24
The same. My gosh, yeah. But if they wanted to put up a marker, that's fine if you're not in the district. 00:54:28
It shouldn't be the same because you're not part of that. 00:54:33
History. 00:54:36
Saint Mary's and how? 00:54:38
The historic district came to be right? Exactly yes. 00:54:39
That's just my thought. That's a good thought. 00:54:45
Anybody else? What else you are thinking? 00:54:48
Well, I have a question here. So you're saying if someone wants a stroke, a marker? 00:54:51
That's OK, but it shouldn't look the same as the other historical markers. 00:54:57
No, not in the district. 00:55:00
Doesn't matter if you're registered in the survey that was done back in 2000. 00:55:03
That would be 1 marker. That would be 1000. 00:55:08
This guy's house is in it. 00:55:13
Is listed in the survey. 00:55:15
But that he deserves. He deserves the full marker. 00:55:17
Right. Well, so I think that's if he wants to be part of the district, right. Oh, he's that's right. He's not in the district, OK. 00:55:20
OK, So doesn't really matter. I mean for like an outsider, they don't know where the boundaries are everything they just want to 00:55:29
put such historical. 00:55:32
Health. I think it might be nice that everything was just kind of cooked. 00:55:36
Just kind of cohesive. 00:55:40
But uh. 00:55:42
But but it's like my neighbor, which you know, her house was built in the 80s. Should she have a historic marker she's with? 00:55:43
I think we need to have the story of historic St. Mary. OK, it's my 1980s neighbors house. She's in the historic district, but 00:55:50
what story does she have to tell? 00:55:55
The house doesn't. It has nothing to do with historic Saint Mary's. Maybe she'll go up for approval. Well, yeah. Oh, absolutely. I 00:56:01
mean. 00:56:05
Well, yeah, but I think we have to come up with, and I'm saying story. I don't know what else to call it, but it's like. 00:56:10
What deems historic St. Mary? 00:56:17
That somebody comes to Saint Mary's and they want to find out the history. 00:56:20
Yeah, of downtown Saint Mary's, whatever that may be. I think we kind of need to figure what that is. 00:56:24
And then say, I think I can be a part of this. And then they send that and it's like, I'm sorry, but no, I mean. 00:56:30
You have nothing to do with the founding or with the Civil War era or whatever it is. Kelly. I think the wording that we're 00:56:37
looking for is what is the historic significance that lends itself to the town? I think, and it's thank you. I mean the but it's 00:56:42
in the ordinance that says these houses have been designated because of their historical nature and what and what lends itself to 00:56:47
that. 00:56:52
And that, but you know, the older our town becomes. 00:56:58
The more homes become. 00:57:01
Year wise qualify as historic. But then you ask yourself. 00:57:03
What, what do they, what lends themselves to the significance of it? I mean, are, are they a certain neoclassical or are they a 00:57:08
certain this or that? And if they're a brick ranch, then that's that's where you have to sort of start to delineate between those, 00:57:15
right. So even though in the 1986 and the the more recent one, it says 50 years. 00:57:22
Is the mark well? 00:57:29
I mean, that really doesn't mean anything. I think that's why we have to be more specific and say it's not. 00:57:31
50 years and then everything's historic. It's. 00:57:38
What? Umm. 00:57:41
Is the significance of Saint Mary's. 00:57:42
And the story that if somebody's traveling from. 00:57:46
Connecticut to come to Saint Mary's and they want to find out the history and kind of like Celinda said with the QR code, then 00:57:49
everything's time. I mean, gosh, you go through so many Saint Augustine, so many different Charleston. 00:57:55
You can find out what the story is and there are the. 00:58:03
The Historic. 00:58:06
Markers given by the HPC. 00:58:08
The city that designate this is a house. 00:58:12
That has a story to tell. 00:58:17
And not just because it just hit the 50 year. 00:58:20
Right. Maybe it'd be helpful to have a year too, like anything we. 00:58:23
For 1930 or? 00:58:28
Whatever. Umm. 00:58:30
But yeah, I would have to have all the information. I mean, that's something. Again, we or someone can, I mean, if we but but 00:58:31
that's for when we. 00:58:35
Right. And we have a list of those homes. Those homes are identified in a registry and those would be the people that would get 00:58:39
the historic significant home. 00:58:44
I mean, I think there should be two kinds of signs, one that says it's a historically designated. 00:58:48
Sign from the registry and another that it's in the historic district. It is a building in the district and for cost effectiveness 00:58:54
there should be two signs and they when they start to get detailed that says this is the Captain Morse sign from, you know, from 00:59:00
the 19. 00:59:05
Those get into the $500 range easily. And then we we don't have any consistency with the signs. I think there should just be two 00:59:11
signs you're either you're. 00:59:17
You're part of the registry, the Saint Mary's Historic Preservation Registry, or you're in the historic district, and the historic 00:59:23
district ones would be purchased by the people requesting them if approved, and the others, I believe, should be given to those 00:59:28
homeowners because of their. 00:59:34
Their duties that they have to preserve these homes. Yeah, I agree 100%, Julia. 00:59:40
Right. 00:59:47
As most people know, federal grant, right? 00:59:48
Hard to come in now. What if they have both? 00:59:50
Well. 00:59:54
I would ask that instead of us going through all of these tonight, would you mind? 01:00:00
If we went through all of those and you numbered them 12345, whatever they are, and then we could give you our top three numbers 01:00:06
if that would be OK. Yeah, that's great. 01:00:11
This group can approve. Can't agree on anything tonight. I can. Yeah. This is the first time I can see you ordering pizza tonight 01:00:16
for us. This is the first time. 01:00:21
Right. OK, let's. 01:00:26
Right, keep it moving and on the other right, and thank you for that. 01:00:27
So, OK, good. I think, you know, kind of restructure this OK, numerical value. 01:00:32
Associated with them with this kind of code from there. 01:00:41
So maybe, you know, I think there's a really good possibility that we're going to agree on the next one. 01:00:44
We're going to what I think there's a really. 01:00:49
High possibility that we're going to agree on the next one. 01:00:52
To adjourn the meeting, yeah. 01:00:54
I make a motion to adjourn the meeting. 01:00:56
I second. 01:00:59
All in favor say aye. 01:01:00
See. Look, we got. 01:01:02
Thank you. 01:01:05
That's, that's democracy, man. Like, you know, you don't have to. 01:01:07